Re: THE OFFICIAL MOYES OUT THREAD

[Hapless_Hans]

Of course you can do it, you HAVE to do it!!!

Time for the players to show up and fight!!

They should remember what club they're playing for, ffs, it's Manchester United, you fight for each other and the manager!!

No short cuts, no spoilt children behavior!! Through thick and thin!! A long term vision!!

Come on, FFS!!

[Busby Babe]

The last time we came back from 2-0 down after the first leg

Robbo  Moyesie

[Hapless_Hans]

in case you haven't noticed, I'm working hard to earn myself the name "*bleep* off Hans"

[S]

If we go out, I hope we do it winning the second leg. It might be our last European night for a long time. It'll probably won't effect Moyes' sacking too, even if we win the second leg and lose on aggregate he's in deep shit.

Calma dude.Its ok to be pessimistic and all but now you're exaggerating it.United will be back on the top soon enough.

I dont know if you have been carried away by the constant negativity shown by RedCafe members.

[Busby Babe]

You never know, Surag.  I've already said in other posts that I think we'll be fine next season, with the right investment and manager. I'm just preparing for the worst, that is all.

And F*ck off Hans

[Busby Babe]

Some tweets from the journo's on twitter. They're not letting it go. Good. They're waiting to pounce the next time Moyes messes up.

jamie jackson ‏@JamieJackson___

David Moyes relocates the real Manchester United but long will it last?  #mufc

Sam Wallace ‏@SamWallaceIndy
MUFC 3-0 Olympiakos, match report. A great CL night for Moyes. A great RVP hat-trick. But it was just Olympiakos

[Hapless_Hans]

Post-match interview

Interviewer: "It that a huge result for you personally tonight?"

Moyes: "Yeah I don't think so... [..] the club know what they've got here, I see myself here for a long time"..

...

Interviewer: "Surely this is gonna help take some of the pressure off you - the magnitude of this result - which can only make your job easier?"

Moyes: "Well I'm not feeling any pressure from inside the club, that's for sure - it's all coming from you people, Jeff, and.. the people around, nobody else! [..] but the players have been great, you know I keep hearing things about 'this one's fallen out' or 'someone else has fallen out' and I keep telling people it's rubbish and it is rubbish - people are trying to look for reasons why we're not doing well [..]"

   

[Busby Babe]

That smugness    

[RED]

You see that grin he had at the end? lol that desperateness.

Calm down Davey. This was just a routine 3-0 win v the scrubs of the last 16. Even at that, he should thank DDG for saving his skin...and the team's.

We're gonna crash back down to earth with an almighty bang in the last 8. The thought of Moyes pitting his wits against the world class managers in the last 8....

[Busby Babe]

Manchester United's Champions League victory over Olympiakos may not save David Moyes, claims Lee Sharpe

Lee Sharpe questions whether David Moyes is the man Manchester United would trust to spend £100 million wisely in the transfer window this summer

Former Manchester United star Lee Sharpe believes David Moyes's days at Old Trafford may still be numbered, despite Wednesday night's Champions League victory against Olympiakos.

Robin van Persie scored a hat-trick to give United the 3-0 win they needed to progress to the quarter-finals of the European Cup.

Some of the gloss was taken off the dramatic night, though, when Van Persie was carried off on a stretcher in the dying minutes of the match after a tackle by Giannis Maniatis.

And the club will swiftly be brought back down to earth this weekend when Premier League duties resume against West Ham at Upton Park.

United will be 15 points adrift of the top four by the time they face the Hammers on Saturday evening, if Arsenal and Manchester City win their games earlier in the day, piling even more pressure on Moyes.

Sharpe said: "I was a bit concerned when Moyes first got appointed. I fancied someone a bit more creative.

"Someone who would bring something a little bit different to the club, like Arsene Wenger at Arsenal or Brendan Rodgers at Liverpool. Moyes is very similar to Fergie."

When asked if he thinks Moyes will be at Old Trafford next season, Sharpe added: "I'm not sure.

"If they've got £100 mililion to spend on transfers, I'm not sure you are going to give it to him to spend.

"If they're still in the same position in the January transfer next year, do you then give someone else a load of money?

"They are going to have to buy a whole new back four, because there's a few of them going, and a couple of midfielders. I'm not sure about the buys he brought in already. He's spent £60m and I don't think he's spent well."

I agree with him, we shouldn't have tried to find the next SAF (Moyes is a really, really, really bad version) we should have gone in a new direction. Perhaps, easier to say in hindsight though. Also right about the £60 mil spent. Too early to say for Mata, he is here for 5 years, we don't know if we'll end up using him right. As for Fellaini, well, when a 40 year old Giggs starts ahead of your £27 mil midfield signing, says it all really.

Fellaini's heat map from last night.

Spoiler:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/manchester-united/10710619/Manchester-Uniteds-Champions-League-victory-over-Olympiakos-may-not-save-David-Moyes-claims-Lee-Sharpe.html

Former Manchester United defender Paul McGrath feels manager David Moyes is facing a players' mutiny.

McGrath explained in the Sunday World: "Players openly wanting to leave, players criticising colleagues for not wanting to pass the ball, one complaining that teammates are getting in his way, players’ wives tweeting after matches in defence of their fellah – if all that is not a mutiny, what is?

"Maybe the players are cheesed off by the style of Manchester United’s football under their new boss, who has to forget about the handbrake he had on his teams, and understandably so at times, when manager of Everton.

"As for the mutiny, I’ve told you here before so many times, there are rows every week in football dressing-rooms. It’s just that in 99.99 per cent of cases the players, never mind the manager, know how to keep it all without the four walls of the dressing room. When it starts leaking out, you’ve got trouble – that’s where the struggling Captain Moyes is now, plugging leaks on his sinking ship.

These quotes are two weeks old.

I think there's definite unrest in the dressing room. Do the players want to force Moyes out consciously? I don't know. They probably do want him out, but not at their expense. Hence, the desire yesterday.

P.S United's greatest fan

Spoiler:

[RED]

SAF is the only one that is keeping Moyes in the job, actually him and Sir Bobby Charlton.

The whole romanticism of a 'young' Scottish manager, doing an OK job of keeping a "broke" team afloat in midtable, get's chosen by thet greatest manager ever, and a fellow Scot, to be his successor. Moyes goes on to carry on the tradition of having fine Scottish managers at United, and writes his name alongside them in the history books.

SAF is a fan of movies. I bet that is exactly how he envisaged it would turn out.

[Busby Babe]

Manchester United: Is it possible to replace a managerial legend?


However closely you look at Wilf McGuinness's head, you will struggle to find any hair.

It is "as smooth as you can get it", he tells me smiling.

   “I managed Manchester United for four seasons - summer, autumn, winter and spring”

Wilf McGuinness

First, his thick black hair turned white. Then, he says, it all fell out - within about a month.

Smiling again, he jokes: "It saves me a hell of a lot on haircuts."

He puts his hair loss down to what happened to him at the football club he has devoted much of his life to.

"I wonder if I could sue," he says, then laughs. "I was going along nicely and then, at the end of it, all my hair started falling out."

The "end of it" refers to the climax of his brief fairytale as manager of Manchester United.

"I managed Manchester United for four seasons," he says. "Summer, autumn, winter and spring."

It was actually about 19 months, but the joke sounds better.



Sir Matt Busby poses with the European Cup alongside Pat Crerand (left) and George Best (right)



McGuinness basically became the filling in a legend sandwich.

He took over from Sir Matt Busby, keeping his seat warm, then left when Sir Matt returned.

Until Sir Alex Ferguson, Busby was the most successful manager in United's history.

He steered the club to five league titles and two FA Cup victories, capping that off with the European Cup.

And all that despite the tragedy of the Munich air disaster, which almost cost him his life and robbed him of a number of his Busby Babes.

Every manager's reign - however successful - has to end eventually. Busby announced his retirement in the spring of 1969.



McGuinness watches from the sidelines as United face Spurs in a Division One game in 1970

"There were people mentioned all the time, bigger names than I was," says McGuinness of the managerial speculation that followed Busby's departure.

Few would have predicted the new boss was going to be a 31-year-old member of his coaching team.

"Matt Busby called me into his office and said: 'Wilf, I'm retiring and you are to be the next manager of Manchester United'. It was 'wow'. I was just delighted about it."
Sir Alex Ferguson and Sir Matt Busby


As David Moyes is discovering, taking over from a living legend can be exceedingly tough. And so it proved for McGuinness.

"We weren't successful enough," he says. "And when you're not successful, people will have a moan."

McGuinness guided United to three cup semi-finals but lost them all.

"If you win things, you're the hero," he says. "If you don't, you're not. I didn't win enough."

Sir Alex Ferguson became a director at United after retirement and can often be seen watching from the stands.

Busby also remained at the club after stepping down, becoming its general manager.

"I was delighted that he was there to just put his hand on my shoulder and guide me," says McGuinness.

He recalls the moment he was called into Busby's office "around Christmas time" in 1970.

"He said: 'I'm very sorry, Wilf. You can have your old job back, but I am taking over Manchester United until we get a new manager'. I was heartbroken. I felt I had to leave - and I did leave. I wouldn't be human if I didn't feel upset about it - and I was upset".

He admits he still is upset. For the first time during our conversation, he looks sad.

"It was a pity," he says. "But that's life. You bite the bullet and get on with it. The job was a big job. I was United through and through and wanted it to last forever which it didn't. I was very hurt by it all."

Then we turn to the question that must have gone through the mind of every Manchester United fan and, very possibly, that of Moyes himself.

Is it impossible to successfully replace a living legend?

"I wouldn't say impossible but it was very difficult to follow the great Matt Busby as manager," he says.

I remind him that Ferguson was even greater - in terms of success - than Busby.

So are Ferguson's boots too big to fill?



McGuinness chats to George Best during a United training session

"The man who takes his place has a big job on. And David Moyes has a big job," says McGuinness, who believes Moyes will succeed.

So having taken over from the club's first knight and failed, what advice would McGuinness give to Moyes?

"Be yourself," he says. "Then, if you don't succeed, you only have yourself to blame."

He adds: "All he needs is a bit of a success. If he doesn't think it's going to happen, buy a couple of players and see if that will work. I'm sure that will."

And his advice to the club's board?

"Stick by this man," he says. "It would be very wrong to change him now. Sir Matt Busby had a tough first season. Fergie had a tough first season."

I ask McGuinness if he thinks Ferguson should do what Busby did and come back.

"Do I heck!" he says.

He rejects the thought that Moyes is the "modern-day Wilf McGuinness".



As a player McGuinness (back row, second from left) was part of a Manchester United squad that also included Bobby Charlton, Duncan Edwards, Dennis Viollet, Bill Foulkes and Tommy Taylor

He points out that the current manager is much more experienced than he was when he took over.

Wilf made his Manchester United debut as a player at the age of 17 and was one of the Busby Babes until a leg injury ended his career.

At the age of 76, he is still working at Old Trafford, entertaining corporate guests on match days.

And he certainly is an entertainer.

Reflecting on his time as boss, he says he should have been given more time.

"Ten years or so," he says, smiling once more.

We do not yet know how much time Moyes will be given.

So far, at least he does still have a full head of hair.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26630276

[Busby Babe]

Sir Matt Busby also chose his successor, Wilff McGuinness only lasted 19 months. What did we do? We let Sir Alex Ferguson pick his successor, in the same style, no interview process. I'm kind of disappointed in Sir Bobby Charlton and Sir Alex Ferguson, because they've seen it before, but let history repeat itself. Fair enough, I understand why you let SAF pick his successor, they think it will be different this time, but in the same manner? No interview process, again?


Alex Ferguson hiring Moyes

United were so sure of Moyes that they did not bother with a job interview. Mourinho once presented a PowerPoint display of his strategy to Roman Abramovich. Brendan Rodgers gave the Liverpool owners a 180-page dossier on his methods, his vision.
Ferguson rang Moyes on May 2, summoned him from a shopping trip with his wife (he was replacing a watch strap, if you must know) and told an astonished Glaswegian that he was the new United manager.
“He took me in, took me up the stairs, made me a cup of tea and came out with it,” Moyes said. “It’s a moment I’ll never forget.”
We might imagine that, whenever it starts, the search for the next United manager will involve rather more formality.

Sir Matt Busby hiring Wilf McGuinness

"There were people mentioned all the time, bigger names than I was," says McGuinness of the managerial speculation that followed Busby's departure.

Few would have predicted the new boss was going to be a 31-year-old member of his coaching team.

"Matt Busby called me into his office and said: 'Wilf, I'm retiring and you are to be the next manager of Manchester United'. It was 'wow'. I was just delighted about it."

Anyway, Wilf McGuinness only got 19 months, but yeah Man Utd give every manager 'time'. Simply put Sir Alex Ferguson earned his time, it was not gifted. 19 months would be a lot of time now, though.

[RedOranje]

Is it possible to replace a legendary manager? Yes, just look at Paisley replacing Shankly at Liverpool... and Fagan replacing Paisley... and Dalglish replacing Fagan.

It can be damned difficult though.

[RED]

Complacency is a natural human trait. Mix that with over confidence and the odds of fcking something up increases substantially.

It can be done, but it requires a lot of time and thinking, a lot of homework. A strategy that includes a group of people too.

To leave our most important decision in 26 years in the hands of SAF alone was incredibly naive by everyone involved. He only confided with Sir Bobby Charlton, and once both were in agreement that Moyes was the man, none of the board members dared to question the decision.

A lot of rumours are circulating that SAF wanted Mourinho but Charlton ruled it out, I personally think that's BS.Mourinho would have been too strong of a personality for their liking anyways. Moyes was the one SAF wanted to hone in his image. A man of a similar background to his and a man who has weak characteristics- happy with what he is given no matter how little it is without kicking up a stink to the higher ups. And they gave him a 6 year contract   

And predictably, the job has turned out to be way too big for him. He is hopelessly out of his depth and looks to have aged 10 years in the space of 10 months.

[El Chelsea Fuerte]

"...Brendan Rodgers gave the Liverpool owners a 180-page dossier on his methods, his vision"

Don't believe it.

[RED]

From the press conference today

The Scot says he could finally look his supporters in the face after his side's 3-0 win over Olympiakos, as the team have not played well enough throughout the season

Manchester United boss David Moyes admits he has felt "ashamed" of some of his side's performances this season.

Last season's Premier League champions beak Olympiakos 3-0 to qualify for the Champions League quarter-finals on Wednesday but the result did not represent United's overall fortunes this season.

"I think the big thing was I could look at the supporters in the face after the game on Wednesday night because I thought we had given them something to shout about, we had nothing to be ashamed of with our performance," the 50-year-old told reporters on Friday.

"In some other games I have felt ashamed because the team haven't played well enough and I've not got a team out which has got a good result."

Moyes also confirmed that Robin van Persie will miss this weekend's trip to West Ham - but that the club have not received anything conclusive on the Dutchman's injury, one he picked up against Olympiakos after scoring a hat-trick.

"We're getting Robin re-scanned today (Friday)," he said. "We're not quite conclusive on everything we've seen.

"We want to just check that out and be sure. He won't be available for tomorrow's game, but we'll try to give you some update when we can on the outcome of it."

United travel to a West Ham outfit who have won the past three home matches and Moyes is well aware of the threat posed by Sam Allardyce's men.

"I think Big Sam has just won manager of the month," he said.

"I don't know if that was his curse last week or if it's still to come this week. But he's done great. They were at a lower league position and he's turned them around.

"We've got a lot of games coming up, we need to make sure that the squad's ready for all the games. That's big for us, that we have all our players fit and available."

Nice words of encouragement there mixed with delusion. The man should be barred from doing press/post match interviews.

[Busby Babe]

David Moyes is right man for Man Utd - Sir Bobby Charlton

Sir Bobby Charlton is "absolutely certain" Manchester United were right to appoint David Moyes as manager.

United legend Charlton concedes the Premier League champions, who face Manchester City on Tuesday, have played "really, really badly" this season.

But the 76-year-old insisted: "It doesn't mean we are going to change everything. I'm absolutely certain that we picked the right man."

United are seventh in the league with only eight games left.

   “Football is cyclical and it will not be long before we are on the up”

They lie 11 points adrift of Arsenal in fourth and 18 behind leaders Chelsea, though they are in the quarter-finals of the Champions League.

They can make up some ground if they beat Manchester City at Old Trafford, but are unlikely to finish in the top four this season.

"We are trying our best to make sure that we can beat them," said Charlton ahead of the derby.

"If we can, it will be a tremendous stride because we've had a bit of criticism leading up to this, but I never doubt Manchester United."

Former United and England midfielder Charlton was one of the famed Busby Babes and made his league debut against Charlton Athletic in October 1956.

Charlton left the club in May 1973 having made 758 appearances, winning three First Division titles, an FA Cup and a European Cup, scoring one of the goals in a 4-2 win after extra time against  Benfica at Wembley in 1968.

He also played 106 times for England and appeared in four World Cups, having a key role when England won the tournament in 1966, beating West Germany 4-2 after extra time in the final.

Charlton, who is in Malaysia for the Laureus World Sports Awards, said part of him was "glad" he would not be at the game because he gets "too excited" at derby matches.

"I always try to keep myself together when I'm in the directors' box, but sometimes I have to get on my feet," he said. "That is one of these occasions."

Writing in Tuesday's match programme, Moyes insisted United would soon be fighting for the title again.

"Football is cyclical and it will not be long before we are on the up," he said in United Review.

"At this present time we sit behind City in the Premier League table, but that is something we will be looking to rectify in the future.

"The title race is something we are aiming to be involved in over the coming campaigns, just as we have been in the past."

The Scot, who replaced Sir Alex Ferguson last summer, added: "Until it is impossible for us to qualify for next season's Champions League with a top-four finish, we will continue to try and reach that goal."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26729956

Oh, there's no hope. We are so unbelievably stupid.

[RED]

Anything to protect their egos and admit they got it wrong with this appointment. Moyes is one of their cronies, so they are blindly loyal to him. Doesn't matter a jot if the club falls all the way down to midtable obscurity under him. "We are United, and sacking managers no matter how sh*t they are, is not the thing we do" Despite us actually sacking managers after a bad spell in the past. We just didn't need to for the past 27 years because we appointed a manager with credentials and a good track record. A genius of a manager who had a vision, and a vision that needed time to implement.

I'm annoyed by their reluctant hope that Moyes could be our SAF 2.0. And that by being given time, he will be afforded the same success- when nothing we're being shown right now suggest that that is a possibility.

We'll continue being a laughing stock, we'll continue playing horrible negative football, we'll continue to get beat by any decent side, we'll continue to play uninspiring football without a hint of progression.

Who cares though, it's nothing we can do while SAF and Sir Bobby hold the club with an iron grip and blindly back their Scottish pet.

[RED]

Ofcourse in saying all that, there is no way Charlton would have stated Moyes' job is on the line. I hope behind the scenes they are all second guessing his appointment.

What that does prove though is that Moyes will def be here next season.

I hate you Moyes you lucky POS. Any other club and you would have gone back in Dec. lucky sob!

[Hapless_Hans]

"At this present time we sit behind City in the Premier League table"

looool you'd think they were second in the table   

[RED]

He's an old man, the mind is not as sharp as it used to be.

[Glory]

He's an old man, the mind is not as sharp as it used to be.

   

[RED]

And I say that with the utmost respect.

[Busby Babe]

'we'll be hard to beat' Oh Bobby The video is not too convincing, he hesitates a bit.

I'm just going to act like Moyes is going to be here until the end of next season, to avoid disappointment when he does in fact stay.

[B-Mac]

anybody on that board isn't going to admit Moyes is the wrong man, even if he is....just like managers don't say players in there squad are shit, senior members of the club aren't going to say there manager is shit lol

wouldn't put any stock into what he says atm

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