Who will replace Carletto ??

farfan wrote:i never denied Pep's influence on the german NT .
.... but that influence was negative and almost cost them against freaking Algeria the moment they did away with that false 9/ Lahm in midfield crap, the team  looked better and went on to win the whole thing .

Mourinho would have never approached that bayern game the way Carlo did . remember the good ol days of  Pepe-Alonso-Khedia ?

Uh huh.....

Mourinho lost to Bayern on Pens...... lets not act like he was completely destroyed AND according to you that Bayern is better than Pep's Bayern.

izzy wrote:

farfan wrote:i never denied Pep's influence on the german NT .
.... but that influence was negative and almost cost them against freaking Algeria the moment they did away with that false 9/ Lahm in midfield crap, the team  looked better and went on to win the whole thing .

Mourinho would have never approached that bayern game the way Carlo did . remember the good ol days of  Pepe-Alonso-Khedia ?

Uh huh.....

Mourinho lost to Bayern on Pens...... lets not act like he was completely destroyed AND according to you that Bayern is better than Pep's Bayern.

i said 2012-2013 Bayern was better,not the Gomez led era .

farfan wrote:i said 2012-2013 Bayern was better,not the Gomez led era .

You said Jupps Bayern....... you have no shame sir.

Gomez being scapegoated like Bale tbh.

If Robben wasn't a choke artist they would have won that year anyway

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Gomez being scapegoated like Bale tbh.

If Robben wasn't a choke artist they would have won that year anyway

Germany and Bayern won the WC and CL respectively the moment Gomez was dropped from both teams .

So a coach playing a player who's injured, who eventually ends up being a main culprit in our losing goal isn't an idiot

http://www.marca.com/en/2015/05/14/en/football/real_madrid/1431606493.html

This is awful if true... If Ramos hid this from Ancelotti I hope he's gone forever. Other case Ancelotti should be out. Ridiculous is this could happen in a game like this.

Bénin wrote:Genuine question to all RM fans : When was the last time you truly liked your manager and please give  his name and tell us why ? Seems like last year many of you liked Carlo because he won la decima and his persona was mourinho's opposite.
Less than half a year later, the dislike began.

i still like him and all, he bring more plus than -
but if he stay meant another season of bale circus. tbh, i think it's better he leave while he still having good memory within fans (probably not all ). either 1 of him or bale must go.

he's still 1 of the best coach, he built a good 13-14 madrid, take away his core players like dimaria and alonso, he come back with another greater 1, our 1st half season of madrid.
modric absent hit bad on that, an unlucky 1, but bale issues, is just sad and depressing, cant stand another season, really.

Imo, i wouldn't mind Carlo for another year. I wanna see if he actually learns his lesson.

It's too premature to get rid of him, and i don't think Klopp will do well given the kind of players Real has

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Gomez being scapegoated like Bale tbh.

If Robben wasn't a choke artist they would have won that year anyway

In theory many teams should have beaten that Chelsea team, but in reality no one could. By far the greatest Cinderella run in CL history.

Anyway on topic. I love Carlo and a great man, but he he doesn't have that strong personality for the Madrid job. Can't let Flo go full retard.

He should move on, won the decima and had a successful stay there.

Pep would be a great choice in all honesty, probably the best manager to serve under Flo.

terrance511 wrote:

Bénin wrote:Genuine question to all RM fans : When was the last time you truly liked your manager and please give  his name and tell us why ? Seems like last year many of you liked Carlo because he won la decima and his persona was mourinho's opposite.
Less than half a year later, the dislike began.

i still like him and all, he bring more plus than -
but if he stay meant another season of bale circus. tbh, i think it's better he leave while he still having good memory within fans (probably not all ). either 1 of him or bale must go.

he's still 1 of the best coach, he built a good 13-14 madrid, take away his core players like dimaria and alonso, he come back with another greater 1, our 1st half season of madrid.
modric absent hit bad on that, an unlucky 1, but bale issues, is just sad and depressing, cant stand another season, really.

About the Bale stuff : Ancelotti is one of the most experienced managers out there. This guy benched Sakho ( formed at PSG, their younger captain ever, french... ) at PSG and stuck with Alex as a starter. If it so obvious to you that Bale must be benched, he must know it too. So the question is why is Bale still playing 90' ? Perez is defo involved so change the manager but if Perez still wants to see Bale as a starter then Bale will start no matter who the manager is.
If Perez says something , you do as he says. At the end of the day he's your boss. I don't think Perez gets involve in the manager's daily work tho.

Fans can keep bashing Carlo and Bale if that make them feel better but their are not the core of the problem.

Blue wrote:

Great Leader Sprucenuce wrote:Gomez being scapegoated like Bale tbh.

If Robben wasn't a choke artist they would have won that year anyway

In theory many teams should have beaten that Chelsea team, but in reality no one could. By far the greatest Cinderella run in CL history.

Anyway on topic. I love Carlo and a great man, but he he doesn't have that strong personality for the Madrid job. Can't let Flo go full retard.

He should move on, won the decima and had a successful stay there.

Pep would be a great choice in all honesty, probably the best manager to serve under Flo.

flo is still the boss at the end of the day and flo is a powerful man.

Man i'd hate to be the Madrid coach, aside from the paychecks of course.

Seasons that would make you legends in the eyes of other top clubs barely get you the nod of moderate approval from fans and 1 season where you fall a few games short means you're shit and need to pack your shit up and gtfo

Tomwin Lannister wrote:Man i'd hate to be the Madrid coach, aside from the paychecks of course.

Seasons that would make you legends in the eyes of other top clubs barely get you the nod of moderate approval from fans and 1 season where you fall a few games short means you're shit and need to pack your shit up and gtfo

It's the lack of growth, the repeating of mistakes.

Us Madrid fans have been saying the same shit for 2 years.

Tomwin Lannister wrote:Man i'd hate to be the Madrid coach, aside from the paychecks of course.

Seasons that would make you legends in the eyes of other top clubs barely get you the nod of moderate approval from fans and 1 season where you fall a few games short means you're shit and need to pack your shit up and gtfo

Won four trophies in 2014, next year is trophyless and people want him sacked There's a thing called stability which is important, if he repeats the same mistake next season then sack him.

i'm not sure firing ancelotti is the answer. Yes, he's made a lot of bone headed moves, yes he's been a yes-man since he came (his inability to fight for di maria after all di maria did for us, and for him really bothered me), also, i'm not sure how much input he had, if any, when it came to signing james (its like he just went with flo on every decision, no disrespect to james, who's been alright), obviously there's the bale and rotation issue, as well as the formation and tactics.

However, why i'm not sure letting him go is the answer is because, the players like him, he has the confidence of most of the players, if not all of them and that really matters; i'm not sure how they'll warm up to yet another new coach, especially one such as klopp, who though very good, will have his own ideas and philosophies, its a testy issue here

also, after this failure, one would expect ancelotti to have grown some cojones and be able to tell flo what players he wants, and bench whoever he wants....i seriously doubt carlo is going to go a whole season without rotating like he did this year again after this fiasco, which now has our rivals in prime position to do a second treble....*bleep* carlo for that....but i'd rather he stayed, if not for anything, at least for stability

titosantill wrote:i seriously doubt carlo is going to go a whole season without rotating like he did this year again after this fiasco

This is the 2nd year he's done it.

He has not learned a thing while being here. 8 GAMES against Atleti, 7 TIMES he played a 4-3-3. He only didn't play it an 8th because of injury.

He makes no adjustments unless there are injuries.

I'm tired of it. I never wanted him here anyway. I've always hated yes men. He did the same at Chelsea.

izzy wrote:

titosantill wrote:i seriously doubt carlo is going to go a whole season without rotating like he did this year again after this fiasco

This is the 2nd year he's done it.

He has not learned a thing while being here. 8 GAMES against Atleti, 7 TIMES he played a 4-3-3. He only didn't play it an 8th because of injury.

He makes no adjustments unless there are injuries.

I'm tired of it. I never wanted him here anyway. I've always hated yes men. He did the same at Chelsea.

Truth. But despite all the evidence people will say the same nonsense.

i understand your gripe with ancelotti, i truly do. i have the same gripe with him as well, whilst we all agree that rotations hampered our season, one thing we haven't asked is 'why ancelotti did not rotate players more often'? My theories are, he was being a yes-man and didn't want to upset florentino, and two he had no confidence in his bench....now to play devil's advocate, aside from lucas, i'm not sure if carlo has made any signings of his own;

bale was florentino, illara was florentino and the board, james was florentino, isco too, and chicharito was brought in when the window was almost close (i'm not sure how much of an input he had with regards to kroos). carlo's input may have just been limited to "yes sign him". now with a chance to get the players he wants, he may feel more comfortable with regards to rotating players. but if you think about it, since he came we can't really point out to a signing that was primarily his decision.

i like klopp, he did well with a moderate dortmund side, built em from the scratch only to have bayern poach some of them. he'll have the luxury of not having such at madrid, but i don't think he wants madrid, and i'm not sure how the players will take to carlo leaving and acclimatizing with a new coach. our players can be spoiled bunches at times....my interest is in stability and maintaining player morale.....the fan in me won't mind carlo out (to pay for the fiasco especially having barca win a potential treble), but from the standpoint of reason, him going might be even more dangerous, with regards to the players. its best we thread with caution on this one

some poster are so clueless, barely following the team but running their mouths off, carlo should be sacked because he is a coward and a idiot, all of his tactics are not thought out but adjustment made to cover up injuries, that happened to worked out well, if no one got injured last season, di maria would've never been played as b2b, just like if bale didn't get injured carlo would have never tried the 442, lets not forget the lack of rotations cause he too scared to drop any starter for a single game

again some of you don't know what your talking about

chad4401 wrote:some poster are so clueless, barely following the team but running their mouths off, carlo should be sacked because he is a coward and a idiot, all of his tactics are not thought out but adjustment made to cover up injuries, that happened to worked out well, if no one got injured last season, di maria would've never been played as b2b, just like if bale didn't get injured carlo would have never tried the 442, lets not forget the lack of rotations cause he too scared to drop any starter for a single game

again some of you don't know what your talking about

aren't these suppose to be what a coach doing?

tbh now it starting to sound a bit miraculously

442 been seen since last season, that so call 433/442 hybrid, it was intentioned by carlo, look like 433 most of the time because bale dont want to def.

other than mismanage of illara, how can he make any new impact squad/system introduce, while the left options are unmotivated khedira, uninspired lucas, never the same jese
and then coentrao arbeloa ...

some of you are too emotional, you see things in only black and white. i've been following this team since the early 90s and i know how hasty decisions can affect the squad. Mind you, i haven't said carlo should not be fired, i haven't hailed him for being some brave heart or super strategist. all i've done is challenged you to think critically about a decision to fire him, because there are positives and negatives involved. its foolish to look at one side without the other.

i'm not related to ancelotti, he doesn't put food on my kids' table, and i'm not some blind supporter of his either. but there has to be a method to our madness. ancelotti is a yes-man, and was outsmarted numerous times in crunch moments, i haven't disputed that...in fact, i have agreed with all that. BUT, people have said fire him and i haven't seen much on who should replace him and most importantly, WHY.

if there is no real analysis on who should replace him, why such person should replace him, what such person can bring to the table with based on their history with regards to transfers, formations, tactical wit, youth developments then most of you are no different from the florentino perez you vilify (of course without his money, experience, brains, tact diplomacy etc...a poorer, more stupid florentino).

and whilst one is busy putting forward coaching suggestions, remember the key is a middle ground; ancelotti is a yes-man, mourinho has cojones, but that too is the other extreme (unless you want that back)

....all i've implored you to do is think critically and not get in your feelings or emotions, we lost yesterday, it feels like shit, that milk has spilled, i've seen many posts on firing him but few on who should replace him (even though that's the name of the thread and WHY)

If there only was some middle way between Mourinho and Ancelotti

Ancelotti the yes to everything guy... Mourinho the control/powermonger...

this tito guy is my new fav poster.

Sorry Tom/RG

terrance511 wrote:

chad4401 wrote:some poster are so clueless, barely following the team but running their mouths off, carlo should be sacked because he is a coward and a idiot, all of his tactics are not thought out but adjustment made to cover up injuries, that happened to worked out well, if no one got injured last season, di maria would've never been played as b2b, just like if bale didn't get injured carlo would have never tried the 442, lets not forget the lack of rotations cause he too scared to drop any starter for a single game

again some of you don't know what your talking about

aren't these suppose to be what a coach doing?

tbh now it starting to sound a bit miraculously

442 been seen since last season, that so call 433/442 hybrid, it was intentioned by carlo, look like 433 most of the time because bale dont want to def.

other than mismanage of illara, how can he make any new impact squad/system introduce, while the left options are unmotivated khedira, uninspired lucas, never the same jese
and then coentrao arbeloa ...

smh do you know anything about footy or you just repeating what you see other posters saying?

the point is if no one gets injured and we are losing with the starting xi, then we gonna keep losing till the season is over get it?

some of you so quick to challenge posts, while being clueless, there is difference between making necessary adjustment and being forced too

chad4401 wrote:

terrance511 wrote:

chad4401 wrote:some poster are so clueless, barely following the team but running their mouths off, carlo should be sacked because he is a coward and a idiot, all of his tactics are not thought out but adjustment made to cover up injuries, that happened to worked out well, if no one got injured last season, di maria would've never been played as b2b, just like if bale didn't get injured carlo would have never tried the 442, lets not forget the lack of rotations cause he too scared to drop any starter for a single game

again some of you don't know what your talking about

aren't these suppose to be what a coach doing?

tbh now it starting to sound a bit miraculously

442 been seen since last season, that so call 433/442 hybrid, it was intentioned by carlo, look like 433 most of the time because bale dont want to def.

other than mismanage of illara, how can he make any new impact squad/system introduce, while the left options are unmotivated khedira, uninspired lucas, never the same jese
and then coentrao arbeloa ...

smh do you know anything about footy or you just repeating what you see other posters saying?

the point is if no one gets injured and we are losing with the starting xi, then we gonna keep losing till the season is over get it?

some of you so quick to challenge posts, while being clueless, there is difference between making necessary adjustment and being forced too

nobody here is rooting for carlo have strong mentality, just saying the guy have the quality to make things work, u dont have to take that credit away just because u hate the guy

@titosantill, i would tell you that Carlo deserved to be sacked mainly on the basis of what his two leagues campaigns have been during the past 2 seasons. Identically poorly planned and managed, both seasons we had the league at some point between january to march and then we just crumbled as a team, holding on to the CL as our saving grace.

It worked one year, as we won it, and the other year, it simply did not. But it's not normal to see a team suffering from the same issues two years in a row, and the manager, not adjusting. Two many instances of the manager refusing to rotate, refusing to trust peripheral players, running our starting eleven to the ground by overplaying them. THat's just poor squad management, and when his style relies so much on us being dominant physically, you could see us getting gased out of ideas and without legs very often in la liga. And his record vs quality teams in la liga, vs barca, atletico, valencia, sevilla... It was bad.

Then there is the football... when we were in top shape physically, we were capable of doing fantastic stuff, but the idea is to get your team to May-June, in top shape to play semis and finals and to win them. He failed at doing that i would say both years overall. And his football, as you said, his 442/433 just fell into his laps as he kept changing formations and as players got injured. It wasnt by design that Di Maria started playing that hybrid position, but he did, and we all remember still what happened then.

This season without di maria, we had more issues sustaining the 442/433, despite Isco/James best efforts, and without Modric, it was near impossible. and this highlights another failing of his, never properly planning and preparing our midfield depth.

At no point was there any kind of dominant idea in the way that we play footy. Maybe he stopped being a thinker long since his milan days, but what he did in madrid, what he survived, and thrived on, were his man management skills. At that he was brilliant, talking to players, managing expectations, being their friends, not manipulating things through mind games, etc... But i am baffled by the lack of ideas he kept having on how we played, always the same schemes, no moving players around, specially Bale, when he is clearly burnt out on the right. It was as if he was out to make a point, but it failed. For someone who had a reputation to be flexible tactically, he hasnt done any of that for months. sure it doesnt help that we have the laziest front 3 in football... but even armed with that knowledge, where were the defensive mids he could have pulled in critical situations to make up for those guys?

So his idea was, let's put BBC up there and they are so good they will games, when it was cleared we had no idea of how to create combination or triangles, and we were just bombarding teams with crosses, as we did vs juve when we were clueless about how to attack them.

So to me, this is my case against Ancelotti, against any manager that plays with no kind of background philosophy and just thinks that managing is about creating a good atmosphere between the guys and keeping them happy and fresh throughout the season till they win things with talent and some timely inspired discipline. We reached the limit of that model.

Since we might be about to change coach again, i will one more time say that i want a coach that comes with certain ideas, and philosophies attached to how and what he does. Whatever they may be, i am not dogmatic about one style of play, but i cant help but notice that some of the most memorable and impactful teams of recent years, have all done it by playing with an identity.

Having top players will always get you to some level in CL, but having top players centered around an idea of play is something we havent had yet. Not that it will guarantee success, but again, if we are going to change, i prefer we would go that way.

So out of all the coaches i see out there, the one that is most qualified to coach is by far Klopp.
1. Gegenpressing, even if that would be a lofty goal to reach for us as a team, specially when our front 3 is so lazy. But it's an aggressive way of playing that fits the type of team that we have.
2. as far as squad management, i think we can agree that he has done pretty good building and developping a large number of players for his dortmund side. Most guy we didnt know before they started having success with bvb.
3. tactically he is sharp, adaptable, and has gotten results both vs bayern and vs the big teams in faced in CL.

But again, the most important point if we are going to change, is the gegenpressing, and all that comes with it.