Pep Guardiola's adventures in Manchester City

Mr Nick09 wrote:Always thought the quality of city's players would be what holds pep's city adventure. He has clearly made some mistakes but dont get me wrong, he went from having God Yaya, prime Busquets, prime Schweinsteiger, Kroos, Alonso to having to play Fernandinho and/or Fernando as regista. there is no that doesnt create issues. From the way they build from the back, to the overall intelligence and quality of the players they have forward. Not to mention we are 3 months into the season.

It's not that there areno easy games, it's simply that he went from teams with overwhelming qualities, to a team where he has some average players no better than those other teams have.

so are you saying he is not a great manager. he is a manager that's just always had much better players.

Meh Pep has blame on this one too. What he see in Korlov and why he took so long to bring on Noilto who has scored 2 of their last 5 goals now is beyond me.

Typical nick shitting on zidane with the rest of sheep, while having wet dreams about pep, now after a string of bad results, deflecting blame on his players instead now , what happened happened to pep taking average players and turning them into beast?

that what you get for being a bandwagon fan and never appreciating your team...

As for pep its already been established that he still has more to prove without messi,xavi and iniesta, his ideas are nice but it ain't the end all be all or revolutionary, that it can be applied to every team and get same result, pep ain't no best manager ever.

Unique wrote:

Mr Nick09 wrote:Always thought the quality of city's players would be what holds pep's city adventure. He has clearly made some mistakes but dont get me wrong, he went from having God Yaya, prime Busquets, prime Schweinsteiger, Kroos, Alonso to having to play Fernandinho and/or Fernando as regista. there is no that doesnt create issues. From the way they build from the back, to the overall intelligence and quality of the players they have forward. Not to mention we are 3 months into the season.

It's not that there areno easy games, it's simply that he went from teams with overwhelming qualities, to a team where he has some average players no better than those other teams have.

so are you saying he is not a great manager. he is a manager that's just always had much better players.

No i am saying that 3 months in, we cant expect him to have his team rolling the same way we saw his barca and his Bayern, and even those teams had losses and werent winning all the time

I am making an assumption that what's he is being compared to right?

But it's also a fact that he is a manager that has only been coaching elite and superior players all of his career, that's not an argument, it's a fact. The amount of trophies he brags about is clearly a reflection of such quality.

I think all "great" managers have coached elite players, it's because they win that we call them "great". I dare you to name me a manager that has achieved great things in his time that wasnt coaching some kind of generational like talent surrounded by elite players of his era. Good luck

chad4401 wrote:Typical nick shitting on zidane with the rest of sheep, while having wet dreams about pep, now after a string of bad results, deflecting blame on his players instead now , what happened happened to pep taking average players and turning them into beast?

that what you get for being a bandwagon fan and never appreciating your team...

As for pep its already been established that he still has more to prove without messi,xavi and iniesta, his ideas are nice but it ain't the end all be all or revolutionary, that it can be applied to every team and get same result, pep ain't no best manager ever.

Hey Chad, it's good to see you posting again man, how are things with the family and all? i hope you are doing good mate, cheers

F*ck you, Chad.

@mrnick, its not just having those players. the league's top is pretty even on paper. its not 1 or 2 teams head and shoulders above everyone like spain or bayern (who even before signing lewa and gotze were still the best). as a result, a draw isn't disastrous, its not just about having great players, on paper, any of the main teams can beat the other on their day.....and that's no diss or criticism towards guardiola, it just is what it is.

Well this was bound to happen, Welcome to the PL Guardiola, Here teams look for your weaknesses and expose you. They don't bend over and pray its less than 4 over 90 minutes.

I remember when Allardyce did not water the pitch in an effort to stop the SAS in the 13-14 season somewhere in April because we were unbeatable and teams just couldn't contain our football, It suited their tactics for hoofing as well.

We needed 2 penalties from Gerrard to win that game and they scored from a set piece

PL

Mr Nick09 wrote:Always thought the quality of city's players would be what holds pep's city adventure. He has clearly made some mistakes but dont get me wrong, he went from having God Yaya, prime Busquets, prime Schweinsteiger, Kroos, Alonso to having to play Fernandinho and/or Fernando as regista. there is no that doesnt create issues. From the way they build from the back, to the overall intelligence and quality of the players they have forward. Not to mention we are 3 months into the season.

It's not that there areno easy games, it's simply that he went from teams with overwhelming qualities, to a team where he has some average players no better than those other teams have.

This would be a nice excuse if he didn't spend £150m in this new squad.

why would i waste my time make excuses for pep? I am explaining a context (the way i see it at least), and it doesnt matter how much they spent, they have no regista in the class or level of the guys i mentioned above. Pretty glaring miss, im not sure what Pep was thinking.

A truly horrendous manager. He has by far the best squad in the League (yet again) so trying to pass blame onto his players is absolutely ludicrous.

Mr Nick09 wrote:why would i waste my time make excuses for pep? I am explaining a context (the way i see it at least), and it doesnt matter how much they spent, they have no regista in the class or level of the guys i mentioned above. Pretty glaring miss, im not sure what Pep was thinking.

You don't rate Gundogan, Nick?

Nishankly wrote:Well this was bound to happen, Welcome to the PL Guardiola, Here teams look for your weaknesses and expose you. They don't bend over and pray its less than 4 over 90 minutes.

It's not so much about the PL being tough as it is about City having an inferior squad to all the teams Pep has coached in the top flight.

I'm sure if he had his Barça or even Bayern, he wouldn't struggle as much as he is now.

Am I making excuses for him? Definitely not, he's the coach and he should've bought quality players to execute his ideas to perfection. So I guess he's entirely to blame here.

But what I don't understand however, is why EPL fans continue to be arrogant even though they have been practically non-existent in Europe in recent years and their overall level has plummeted to the ground.

Meanwhile, La Liga has been beating the holy hell out of everybody winning three CLs in a row, 5 CLs since 2009, with two all-Spanish finals just in the last three years, from the same City, and dominating the semi-final places since 2010. And what's even more impressive is that this total domination wasn't exclusive to the CL alone, the Europa Sevilla league also has been ruled by La Liga winning 4 titles in the last 5 years alone.

Please understand that I'm not belittling your league or the folks watching it. I'm just baffled and confused as to why you continue to poke fun at La Liga even though you don't even come close to it in terms of success.

I think the EPL and its fans (not all of them of course cause some of them are really great) need to learn some humility, especially when it's needed.

The Demon of Carthage wrote:

Nishankly wrote:Well this was bound to happen, Welcome to the PL Guardiola, Here teams look for your weaknesses and expose you. They don't bend over and pray its less than 4 over 90 minutes.

It's not so much about the PL being tough as it is about City having an inferior squad to all the teams Pep has coached in the top flight.

I'm sure if he had his Barça or even Bayern, he wouldn't struggle as much as he is now.

Am I making excuses for him? Definitely not, he's the coach and he should've bought quality players to execute his ideas to perfection. So I guess he's entirely to blame here.

But what I don't understand however, is why EPL fans continue to be arrogant even though they have been practically non-existent in Europe in recent years and their overall level has plummeted to the ground.

Meanwhile, La Liga has been beating the holy hell out of everybody winning three CLs in a row, 5 CLs since 2009, with two all-Spanish finals just in the last three years, from the same City, and dominating the semi-final places since 2010. And what's even more impressive is that this total domination wasn't exclusive to the CL alone, the Europa Sevilla league also has been ruled by La Liga winning 4 titles in the last 5 years alone.

Please understand that I'm not belittling your league or the folks watching it. I'm just baffled and confused as to why you continue to poke fun at La Liga even though you don't even come close to it in terms of success.

I think the EPL and its fans (not all of them of course cause some of them are really great) need to learn some humility, especially when it's needed.

La Liga fans need to stop with this nonsense, Why do you keep bringing up the CL and the EL when this comparison/personal bias/discussion always is almost exclusive to domestic competitions.

CL or EL is not the measure of how competitive internally a league is and it will never be so stop using foreign examples and give me enough credentials within the La Liga so that i can actually not be surprised when Real or Barca drop points.

European Success =/= Internal competitiveness

And this is valid for even smaller leagues, Its just that they don't get enough marketing.

Really baffles me how La Liga fans still manage to interpret this as a discussion about European success when Barcelona and Real Madrid are light years infront of every team in the PL.

yes definitely Lol Loga fans are the most insecure ones here !

Won't criticize him until the end of the season. As the resident City fan, no point in getting into a hysteria after 9 games and top of the table

Areas of Concern though:
* Should drop Aguero for Iheanacho, Aguero been out of form and is being a selfish POS on top of that. Refuses to pass in the box when we are chasing a game, ending up with his shot getting blocked

* lack of fullback targets during the summer and not playing Pablo Maffeo (city youth players) instead of Kolarov. However, it appears that Pep is going to a 3 at the back with Otamendi-Stones-Kompany. Don't want to relay on Kompany tbh.

* Finishing/Goals when Goatnacho is on the bench. Only KdB, Nolito, and Aguero can be expected to score.

* Drop Gundogan against scrub teams. No need to have both Fernandinho and Gundogan. Play 4-1-4-1 with 4 being Sane, Sterling, KdB, and Goatnacho in the hole.

How the hell did this turn into "my league is better than yours"

City have: Bravo, Otamendi, Kompany, Gundogan, Silva, Sane, Debruyne, and Aguero. That's a bloody good spine. Alot of them could get into many top teams out there. Then they have a few players that could make the difference off the bench like Nolito, Ihenacho and Sterling. Pep not having good players is so fictionally hilarious. Them being in this rot is all on him, obviously it doesn't help that his team keep making these small errors every game. But he has got to understand that sometimes you have to form your tactics based on the players you have got. When you see Fernandinho making passes left and right it makes you wonder what the hell Pep is smoking.

I mean look at this line up:


This team wouldn't look out of place amongst the elite. Instead he plays:


I mean how retarded can you be to think all these "revolutionary" formations are going to work. Is his ego that big he sees a logical formation as something that's beneath him.

And for you saying he has got the wrong players? I mean which player is left that City haven't bought yet? They got Gundogan who many top teams wanted, they already have Silva who'd walk into alot of top teams, they already had Debruyne somebody who was one of th best players in BL before he got there, they bought Sane for 50 something million, they got Nolito, one of the best players in LL last season who was actively tracked by Barca etc.

Internal Competitiveness

Being proud of this? why? Who cares, would love for my team to dominate this league like Bayern/Juve does theirs. I would think Liverpool would want less competition so they can actually win the PL for once.

Its true that La Liga fans are insecure because no one actually cares about La Liga.

Guys, City (Pep) is still leading the table. Lets at least wait for the rest to pass them before we slam them to much.

One more draw and they could drop down to like 6th place or something like that

nasir6371 wrote:

Internal Competitiveness

Being proud of this? why? Who cares, would love for my team to dominate this league like Bayern/Juve does theirs. I would think Liverpool would want less competition so they can actually win the PL for once.

Its true that La Liga fans are insecure because no one actually cares about La Liga.

That's valid if your team has what it takes to be the best, If they aint then everyone needs to be close XD

@hala

That's easier said then done, there is no guarantee how your lineup would match up and for all we know might be worse then any lineup Pep has used. Also Kompany has just returned from injury and has played a total of only 2 games, Sagna and Zaba are nursing injuries, so at the moment City don't actually have a RB.

But lets look at somethings here:

- Stones, Nolito, Gundo, Sane, Bravo are all new to the team, aside of Stones the rest are new to the league and need adjusting time, 3 months is not enough. Nolito and Bravo don't even know English that well either.

- The team is still coming to terms, with Pep style of play in terms of possession and positional play, which again isn't going to happen overnight.

- Sterling/Sane are in their early 20's and not finished products yet, so they aren't Robben-esque players to win you games.

- Gundo has returned from a 5-6 month injury layoff and as you can see he still not at his best, which is understandable. Sane has also recently returned from injury I think he's only 7-8 games in.

- As you have stated individual errors haven't helped his team.

- Aguero has gone 5 games without a goal to his name, so hard for you to win games when your star striker isn't netting them.

- City in these last 5 games are averaging 16 shots per game and about 6-7 on target, yet only manage to score 5 goals. I believe they've also missed their last 3-4 PK.

There is still a lot to look into here as well.

Now things that Pep isn't helping himself with:

- A poverty lineup choice against one the best teams in the prem (Spurs).

- Sterling, has been solid on the right, but Pep uses him on the left were he simply isn't the same player (reminds me of Tata with Neymar).

- Love affair with Kolarov, reminds me of Mou and Ivanovic at Chelsea.

- Gundo/Silva/KDB, someone said this early it'll be hard to get that midfield to work and would crowd them, which seems to be the case. I certain matches it'll benefit them, but overall it won't.

- Subs this season have been questionable at times, yesterday he needed more attacking threat, but bought Nolito on in the 90th minute. Nolito has scored 2 of City last 5 goals, got a draw for them against Celtic and scored the equalizer against Everton.

- When Sagna was available Pep would still select Zaba who's worst player out of the two

- Despite all the money City have and spent this summer failure to buy a FB is going to hurt him (all City FB are at the age of 30 or older).

I'm sure there's more I can add as well as others, but as you see there are two sides to this, blame does sit on him in certain aspect, but not entirely.

As far as having one of the best squad on paper yes, but the team still needs time to get it together, 4 of the 5 players and once G, Jesus comes in 5 of the 6 players are new to the league, the manager is new to the league, as well as still trying to get the squad to play his way, is going to take some time.

I agree that there has to be some level of patience when it comes to the new players but most of the ones Pep is playing have either played for another PL team or were already there from before. You can argue that Sane and Gundogan should expect patience but every single other outfield player has played in PL before Pep arrived so should have no excuses when it comes to giving disappointing displays. Pep has to take alot of the blame for playing a formation his players arent the least bit comfortable in. I mean how many players in that line up have experience playing his weird formation? Scratch that how many have experience playing 3 at the back bar maybe Stones?

All this tinkering will get him nowhere. Klopp for example came in chose a system to suit his players and he is reaping the rewards right now eventhough he has a bunch of average players at his disposal. City are already destined to finish 2nd in the CL group and will probably play one of the heavy weights in the last 16. They might turn it around in the league because teams around them will keep dropping points so they will be able to afford all these dropped points. But how long till Pep realises his formation/tactic is flawed and needs to be changed?

Like with any player... coaches need time to adapt to their new team...  and even moreso to a new league.  

You won't know what you have for this particular season until you see how City is playing come December/January.

I would remind people that Carlo was awful in his first 12 months at PSG and his first 5 at Real Madrid.  Laurent Blanc the same in his first 5 months at PSG.

It all comes down to how much you're asking your players to adjust from what they're accustomed to AND how good the team is period.  If there are a lot of adjustments and/or you lack team quality, it will take a while.

sportsczy wrote:Like with any player... coaches need time to adapt to their new team...  and even moreso to a new league.  

You won't know what you have for this particular season until you see how City is playing come December/January.

I would remind people that Carlo was awful in his first 12 months at PSG and his first 5 at Real Madrid.  Laurent Blanc the same in his first 5 months at PSG.

It all comes down to how much you're asking your players to adjust from what they're accustomed to AND how good the team is period.  If there are a lot of adjustments and/or you lack team quality, it will take a while.

it's the era of instantaneous results. City will give pep the time and have geared the club almost perfectly for him. The media are relentless.

That's the point of learning tho, if he doesn't play these type of formation the players will never adjust to them. It was the same at Barcelona/BM were he played similar weird formation (which cost us points at times, lets not forget his away games in CL), but eventually the team adjusted to it. His final year at BM is an example the amount of variation they had and were able to change formation on the fly was amazing to see. Throughout his career these formation and experiments have benefited him, yes he doesn't always get it right.

As far as back 3 go City have only conceded 9 shots on target in 3-4 games playing the back three, they completely dominated Everton and missed 2 PK with the same formation, I don't think his back 3 has been that big of a problem thus far. And Stones/Kompany screwing up with the pass doesn't mean his back 3 was the problem.

Klopp approach is similar to that of Dortmund, he's just had time to adjust to the PL and his squad (he joined Oct. last year), were as Pep has only had 15 games. As nick said in reality Pep squad is still going to need improvement and a lot of players aren't good enough for what he wants and what he has coached before.