Re: The Official WWE Thread - Part 24

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

You realize MT that nothing is actually going to change if Shane wins or not lol, even from a Kayfabe point of view.

Also it's quite clear at this point that the main event doesn't even need to be ticket selling anymore, the brand sells itself on name along like Super Bowl does for most people. Up to you whether you like it or not but that is a reality.

Also i just flat out disagree with the RAW comparison, RAW has like 10 minute matches at most majority of the time and it's all storyline. The only Storyline you get at PPVs are the story they sell during the matches.

Just to use an example, the build for Undertaker vs Lesnar was hot *bleep* garbage but you still all looked forward to it and i wonder why that is....

Matches a lot more important than you are willing to admit to yourself. Also you are both acting like there is no build at all with these matches, there is it's just not build you are interested in.

[Onyx]

It probably doesn't need to be ticket selling from their standpoint, but I'm just saying as a fan it should be. It's basically the 'WWE don't need to improve, there's no competition, they can live off their reputation' discussion. A lot of people will agree that the product needs to improve regardless of the WWE being well off financially.

Taker/Lesnar? 2 huge stars going up against other, that's the draw. If that was the main event I wouldn't have been happy because the build sucked. But obviously with them being part time superstars, there's nothing much they could really do.

When it comes to matches, what I'm saying is there has to be a draw that gets me to watch the match. A unique story, a good build or simply star power. If every match this WM turns out to be 5*, it wouldn't matter to me because that's now how I judge an event. It's a combination of the things I've mentioned so far.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

I call bullshit tbh because plenty of times we have not watched the build up and still watched the PPV in the past.

Also if the matches are irrelevant why even watch the PPV at all, the following RAW will continue the storyline anyway.

If storyline is all you care about then no-one would actually watch WWE and watch actual real TV series, it's just an excuse because you are all so negative about the current product.

How many times have we all come on here and asked what's the card? Determining if it's shit or not despite not watching for months, no one ever asked what's the story behind each match no they ask what the actual matches are.

We have all done it, which leads me to believe as negative as you all are about it you care about the match quality. If you didn't you would never watch PPVs.

Also MT you are wrong about about match quality always being high at PPV, there's so many examples to the contrary and if anything more often than not they are not good.

Last I'm going to say on this subject tbh and also there's build this year to a lot of matches you are just not interested in it. A lot of matches have been built since the Rumble, so we need to stop acting like it's just a load of random wrestling matches with no build at all because that isn't the case.

I mean it was the case last year, with the most meaningful thing was Lesnar and Reigns playing tug of war with the belt a week before mania

Negativity has a strange effect though, believe me I know being a fan of a toxic football club. But there's plenty of times in the past where we all watched either shit events with no build or just didn't have any recognition of the build, so please don't act like this a sudden thing where magically the matches don't matter when it always had and if it didn't you wouldn't look forward to PPVs and just ignore their existence and see how Raw follows up.

All these years saying how great something was at a PPV and staying up till 5 in the morning and it didn't matter? Give me a break lol.

[Onyx]

But that's what I'm talking about though, star power clashes. Looking at the card and seeing huge stars going up against each other is one of the reasons that gets people to watch the PPV. I doubt they tune in hope of witnessing a 5* Meltzer-riffic classic. Well at least I don't.

Put Hogan vs Cena on a WM card with little to no build and I'd look forward to it because it's 2 icons clashing. Not because of the possibility of them having a 10* match.

In terms of the build, I'm not denying that there's been any build. I'm just saying there's no elite must watch controversial story like the Yes movement, Rock/Cena etc. HHH/Reigns is a B level PPV main event.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

That scrub Russo has poisoned MTs mind imo

[Onyx]

I liked Reigns/Lesnar last year because it was a unique match due to Lesnar's unique wrestling style. You've got this superman in Reigns, going up against an unstoppable beast. What will happen when these 2 huge forces collide? That's the draw to the match.

The majority of matches don't interest me because I've seen a hell of a lot of matches and I know the formula inside out. There has to be a unique backstory or something at stake going into the match.

Give me a match like Punk vs Cena MITB and I'll be glued to the screen because of what's at stake and the amazing backstory. Bryan vs Orton vs Batista wasn't exactly an amazing match, but again, I was glued to the screen because of the amazing backstory and wanting to see whether Bryan would get his moment or not.

[Kaladin]

Y'all are gonna watch it anyways even after complaining

[M99]

Except Bryan vs Orton vs Batista and Reigns vs Lesnar were both quite good.

Goldberg vs Lesnar had all the backstory but the match was godawful which is why people look back negatively on the feud and the match got terrible reception.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

While I agree in general M99 i didn't like the triple threat between Bryan, Batista and Orton but the reasoning is I hate triple threats where one of the participants is laid out for long periods.

It's just a personal pet hate I have and to be fair to all 3 it's probably one of the better examples of such.

[Onyx]

Of course yeh, if the match sucks then there's a problem. I'm not saying matches don't matter.

My original point is that the storylines suck this year, so does the main event and there's a lack of star power and draw. Now imo, if the actual event has a whole bunch of 5* matches, it doesn't suddenly make WM a success. PPV's can't be judged on match quality alone, especially not WM.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

Well to me it does, because the two are separate entitys.

If all the matches are great, you can't sit here and say the event sucked because they failed to build it up properly.

That's on the RAW's and Smackdown's to build it, has nothing to do with the actual PPVs itself.

While we are discussing this though, how did you rate last years? Because the build was even worse and on paper quite frankly the matches seem to worse too. ( obviously we can't compare that reality yet)

[Onyx]

I see it all as one entity. If I say the PPV was a success simply because the matches were good, then to me it's like saying the overall product is good and it would mean that I'm overlooking the fact that the build up/story sucked.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

No it just means the talent are good enough to put on a good show when the creative are lacking in good ideas.

[M99]

Brock vs Dean had the best storyline until they shoehorned the Wyatts into it for no reason. We could have Ambrose vs Heyman promo battle but instead they give us Ambrose vs Strowman (:

We could have had a great personal feud in Sami Zayn vs Kevin Owens but since they need to give the roster the WM paycheck they give us a ladder match with randomized participants.

Jericho vs AJ could have been better too if they had not fought three times already.

Reigns vs Triple H actually has a deep and good backstory but its not working with Reigns as the underdog superman.

Same with Shane vs Undertaker, except I still don't know why Undertaker is fighting for Vince.

Ryback vs Kalisto lol. Started from that legendary promo from Ryback.

Divas match is fine but the buildup has been awful. Just some random matches involving the women.

[Onyx]

Let's not over complicate stuff.

Basically the product is shit, so I'm not interested in WM. And WM having good matches doesn't make up for a shit product. Unless of course Cena comes out at the end and turns heel, in which case WM was goat.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

Let's not over complicate stuff.

Basically the product is shit, so I'm not interested in WM. And WM having good matches doesn't make up for a shit product. Unless of course Cena comes out at the end and turns heel, in which case WM was goat.

Never said it does

In fact i have been quite consistent with the point that WWE has been crap since 2006 Only reason i started watching again was because AJ was debuting and i realized there's quite a lot of guys and girls for that matter who i like and live in hope it will eventually be good despite the fact i know that to be extremely unlikely.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

Brock vs Dean had the best storyline until they shoehorned the Wyatts into it for no reason. We could have Ambrose vs Heyman promo battle but instead they give us Ambrose vs Strowman (:

We could have had a great personal feud in Sami Zayn vs Kevin Owens but since they need to give the roster the WM paycheck they give us a ladder match with randomized participants.

Jericho vs AJ could have been better too if they had not fought three times already.

Reigns vs Triple H actually has a deep and good backstory but its not working with Reigns as the underdog superman.

Same with Shane vs Undertaker, except I still don't know why Undertaker is fighting for Vince.

Ryback vs Kalisto lol. Started from that legendary promo from Ryback.

Divas match is fine but the buildup has been awful. Just some random matches involving the women.

Agree with most of that, i like the Diva build though. Probably because i enjoyed the NXT stuff so i'm probably already invested.

Also i think the Jericho and AJ angle changes as a result of Jericho going heel, that's different to the standard we respect each other stuff and thus i'm invested into it.

[RealGunner]

Y'all are gonna watch it anyways even after complaining

Ofcourse I'll watch it. it's WM afterall. Not live though

If anything, going with no expectations will only make me like it more if its good

[Casciavit]

Read the Smackdown spoilers. It seems likely that the Wyatt family will interfere during the Ambrose-Lesnar match.

[RealGunner]

To start a feud with who? Ambrose or Lesnar?

[Casciavit]

Lesnar. I'm not against them feuding. I actually want to see a feud, but if an interference occurs during the match it's going to be awful.

[M99]

For ES.

[RealGunner]

Lesnar. I'm not against them feuding. I actually want to see a feud, but if an interference occurs during the match it's going to be awful.

I don't know what will come off that feud. Lesnar will win every single match against Bray. Only thing that can happen is to have a handicap feud with PPVs involving Brian Strootman and Bray vs Lesnar.

That would be interesting IMO and fresh.


And then at some point Rowan makes it 3 v 1 so Cena could make his return to help Lesnar.

[Onyx]

Really miss Edge, Jeff and JR.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

Bray is injured btw, it's why he doesn't have anything at WM.

I wouldn't be surprised if they are building towards Lesnar and Bray at some point in the future whenever Lesnar's dates allow.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

Wrestlemania 27 i just re-watched it sadly.

I think the people who say this year will be the worst ever should watch all the shit ones as a result of their punishment tbh.

Jerry Lawler vs Michael Cole, Miz in the main event and winning the main event, John Morrison, *bleep* Snookie and Trish vs Laycool and Dolph Ziggler is 2nd to last match.

HHH and Taker was good but the rest is unbelievable Snitsky and Santino Marella bullshit ( who is also on the card btw )

I'm never going to get these nearly 4 hours back.

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