OFFICIAL: FIFA Ballon d'or 2013 - Voting extended

The Awesome wrote:

Khaled wrote:

The Awesome wrote:Their overall attributes, naturally.

Can you explain more.

For example, Messi can finish like Pele, dribble like Maradona and he's a world class playmaker.
He's the most complete player ever.

Cristiano is a great goalscorer, but he's far behind in terms of dribbling, passing, creating, team work and overall achievements!

Yes, but he's far ahead in in terms of Speed, Strength, Stamina and is quite an Iron Man as he hardly injures himself not to mention the he can also Dribble, Cross, FK & PK, Heading, and a Long Shot combine that with Tenacity. CR's definetely the more complete player. But of course, it isn't enough.

The reason I put Ribery ahaed of Ronnie or Messi is simply because he's lead (has been leading for some time now along with Robben) Bayern to the final stages of important competitions. It was high time he finally got his gold.

There attributes have nothing to do with FOOTBALL Skills [Finishing, Passing, Creating, Dribbling, these are the main qualities for a forward].
Speed (last time I checked Messi was 6th in terms most fast football players, Cristiano only 2Km faster..)
Strength and Stamina? unlike Cristiano who falls after every contact, Messi stays on his feet which help dribbler 3+ players!

Complete player?
who carries if he finishes by head, left or right foot. What matters is number of goals and his conversion.

Harmonica wrote:

FalcaoPunch wrote:

Harmonica wrote:Why should Ribery win it, he wasn't good in the CL and didn't carry Bayern to the league Maradona Napoli style, like Messi did?

Don't compare a that Napoli to this Barcelona.

It's a terrible comparison.

Only time that logic would apply is if Messi moves to another team while he is still relevant and pulls off what he does now at Barca.

Don't talk about something you have absolutely no clue about.

Don't talk about comparing a Napoli that without a doubt did not have a squad as complete as this current Barcelona and their only standout was Maradona that helped lift that team.

You're clueless in comparing Maradona and his Napoli and Messi and his Barcelona.

Khaled wrote:
There attributes have nothing to do with FOOTBALL Skills

*sigh* Smh

FalcaoPunch wrote:

Harmonica wrote:

FalcaoPunch wrote:Don't compare a that Napoli to this Barcelona.

It's a terrible comparison.

Only time that logic would apply is if Messi moves to another team while he is still relevant and pulls off what he does now at Barca.

Don't talk about something you have absolutely no clue about.

Don't talk about comparing a Napoli that without a doubt did not have a squad as complete as this current Barcelona and their only standout was Maradona that helped lift that team.

You're clueless in comparing Maradona and his Napoli and Messi and his Barcelona.

I didn't compare Barcelona and Napoli, I compared the relation between Messi/Barca and Maradona/Napoli.

Ronaldo being physically more complete than Messi doesn't make him overall more complete. Messi is more complete technically. Also I think technical skills are more valuable on the big stage. Technical skills can impact the match more.

The Awesome wrote:

Khaled wrote:
There attributes have nothing to do with FOOTBALL Skills

*sigh* Smh

These*


When you compare two players, you compare their FOOTBALL skills. We're playing football, its not a 100m race

Even interms of Stamina and strenght, Messi is still ahead....

Khaled wrote:

The Awesome wrote:

Khaled wrote:
There attributes have nothing to do with FOOTBALL Skills

*sigh* Smh

These*


When you compare to players, who compare their FOOTBALL skills. We're playing football, its not 100m race  

I think we're done here.

If one cannot comprehend to understand that Physicality is an important attribute as every other attribute than......what can I say.

Khaled wrote:What matters is number of goals and his conversion.

And exactly that shouldn't matter for the Ballon d'Or. After all, GKs can be superb, too, but other than Rogério Ceni they are usually not great scorers for their team. ^^

Although I don't agree, lets say CR is better physically. How does this help him in a football match?
Speed, Stamina and Strength are attributes that should help you to finish better [power] and dribble better [stay on his feet] etc...

As we know, Messi is a better finisher and better dribbler...

Again, why are assuming that Critisano is better physically. Why does he fall down after every contact, while Messi can stay on his feet?

rwo power wrote:

Khaled wrote:What matters is number of goals and his conversion.

And exactly that shouldn't matter for the Ballon d'Or. After all, GKs can be superb, too, but other than Rogério Ceni they are usually not great scorers for their team. ^^

did you read the whole post? :-)
I said when you compare two players in terms of finishing, number of goals and conversion rate what matters. I'am not talking the ballon d'or.

Infact, in a previous post I mentioned that its not about who scores more. Its overall individual performance, influence on the team and individual/team achievements!

Yohan Modric wrote:Ronaldo being physically more complete than Messi doesn't make him overall more complete. Messi is more complete technically. Also I think technical skills are more valuable on the big stage. Technical skills can impact the match more.

It all depends on how good the player is at what he does. Messi & Ronaldo are both the best at what they do and that's why in La Liga they're both more or less unstoppble. Ribery isn't as Physical nor Technical as Ronnie or Messi but I see a much better Leader than either of them. And that leadership has proven vital for Bayern's recent succeses. Finally, now we see Ribery contending the Ballon D'Or, which I believe should be his this season.

Khaled wrote:did you read the whole post? :-)
I said when you compare two players in terms of finishing, number of goals and conversion rate what matters. I'am not talking the ballon d'or.

Infact, in a previous post I mentioned that its not about who scores more. Its overall individual performance, influence on the team and individual/team achievements!

Oops. Looks what happens when I'm installing a new kernel, watch the Friday BL match and look at the chat, too. My apologies ^^

But still I'd like to see at least Manuel Neuer and Roman Weidenfeller in the Ballon d'Or shortlist ^^

Harmonica wrote:

FalcaoPunch wrote:

Harmonica wrote:Don't talk about something you have absolutely no clue about.

Don't talk about comparing a Napoli that without a doubt did not have a squad as complete as this current Barcelona and their only standout was Maradona that helped lift that team.

You're clueless in comparing Maradona and his Napoli and Messi and his Barcelona.

:facepalm:I didn't compare Barcelona and Napoli, I compared the relation between Messi/Barca and Maradona/Napoli.

The relations of carrying a team, yes I get it.
Now think for a sec as to which team was heavier.

rwo power wrote:

Khaled wrote:did you read the whole post? :-)
I said when you compare two players in terms of finishing, number of goals and conversion rate what matters. I'am not talking the ballon d'or.

Infact, in a previous post I mentioned that its not about who scores more. Its overall individual performance, influence on the team and individual/team achievements!

Oops. Looks what happens when I'm installing a new kernel, watch the Friday BL match and look at the chat, too. My apologies ^^

But still I'd like to see at least Manuel Neuer and Roman Weidenfeller in the Ballon d'Or shortlist ^^

no worries :-) I think Neuer might make it to Top 23...

rwo power wrote:Oops. Looks what happens when I'm installing a new kernel, watch the Friday BL match and look at the chat, too. My apologies ^^

But still I'd like to see at least Manuel Neuer and Roman Weidenfeller in the Ballon d'Or shortlist ^^

Just Neuer, RWO. He's a champ.

FalcaoPunch wrote:

Harmonica wrote:

FalcaoPunch wrote:Don't talk about comparing a Napoli that without a doubt did not have a squad as complete as this current Barcelona and their only standout was Maradona that helped lift that team.

You're clueless in comparing Maradona and his Napoli and Messi and his Barcelona.

:facepalm:I didn't compare Barcelona and Napoli, I compared the relation between Messi/Barca and Maradona/Napoli.

The relations of carrying a team, yes I get it.
Now think for a sec as to which team was heavier.

What? Messi and Maradona was just as influential, individually in relation to the team. Most Barca players were god awful, when most Napoli players played great, in their standards. Only Iniesta gets good review from last season, and I think he was still below example Careca and Carnevale in influence.

Wasn't Barca the best team of all time ? Now we are comparing Messi's season in which he was injured for a few matches, owned by Ronaldo everytime they faced each other and got trashed by Bayern 7-0 to Maradona in Napoli ? A team with the best midfielders of all time, one of the best RB's of all time(according to some Barca fans), the second coming of Beckenbauer in defense is reliant on one player ?

Ronaldo deserves to win it.

btw, saying Ronaldo shouldn't be in the first 3

Harmonica wrote:

FalcaoPunch wrote:Why in hell would messi deserve to win this year?

Carried Barcelona to league, Maradona Napoli style. Scored 21 league games straight, expressing never seen consistency and efficiency. Showed unlimited individualism when he came and lifted Barcelona to CL-semis, still being unfit. All these are beyond anything what Cronaldo, or Ribery did to showcase their craft.

So what you're saying is that Barcelona is a one-man team?

Yohan Modric wrote:It's the best individual player, doesn't matter about what the team did.

Scoring 55 goals makes him a contender. Messi won it in 2011-12 when Barca won no major trophy.

Team achievement has ALWAYS mattered, especially when there are 2 or 3 players that performed very similarly. The only times team achievement don't matter is when an individual player's performance was too good to ignore. Like Messi scoring 91 in a year. Only thing that can top that is if you won 2 world cups in the same year


But on this, Ribery definitely has a better shot than Ronaldo and this is coming from someone whose favorite player is Ronaldo.

1. Messi
2. Ribery
3. Iniesta
4. Xavi
5. Neymar
6. Ronaldo
7. Robben


Pure individual brilliance. Not sure about 6/7 - could switch any game.

Neymar, Xavi, Iniesta over Ronaldo? Pls go.

silver wrote:

Harmonica wrote:

FalcaoPunch wrote:Why in hell would messi deserve to win this year?

Carried Barcelona to league, Maradona Napoli style. Scored 21 league games straight, expressing never seen consistency and efficiency. Showed unlimited individualism when he came and lifted Barcelona to CL-semis, still being unfit. All these are beyond anything what Cronaldo, or Ribery did to showcase their craft.

So what you're saying is that Barcelona is a one-man team?

Last season, in the sense that can be in a team game.

Blue Barrett wrote:Neymar, Xavi, Iniesta over Ronaldo? Pls go.

Ballon d'Or is a PERSONAL voting system. I am not going anywhere. Didnt Casillas vote Ramos over Ronaldo last year?

Everyone who doesn't have Ronaldo and Messi in their top 2 is out of his mind. These 2 are far ahead of any footballer

btw : what the hell are Xavi and Iniesta doing there ?

The definition of 'the top 3 players'  in the world is different for everybody. One might find vision and passing much more important then off the ball movement and scoring, hence why there is a voting system, so everybody gets their say in the final results. Even if you would look at only statistics, its still a open discussion. You have goals + assists, but what leads to a assist? Was that also a contribution to the goal? There is no right or wrong in these discussion, only opinions and other views on what players need to be the 'best'.

For somebody who is a fan of players with high futbol intelligence and vision perhaps Pirlo or Xavi is the best player in the world. For someone like rwo- a goalkeeper is the best player in the world. Someone who likes dribbles and vision, Messi is the best player in the world. And another one would say Ronaldo is the best in the world because he scores from ridiculous ranges like no other. Messi doesn't have Pirlo's vision, Pirlo doesn't have Messi dribbling abilities, both dont have Ronaldo's long range shooting and vice versa. How can you decide for the whole wide world who is the better player? You cant, only your opinion on what makes someone the best can decide.

So, for me personally, i enjoy vision combined with high intelligence passes, dribbling skills and finishing. Again, for me (!!) Messi, Xavi, Iniesta, Ribery and Neymar have these abilities more then Ronaldo and Robben. On other aspects, like finishing; headers; freekicks, Ronaldo and Robben might stand out more against earlier named players, but I dont take that in consideration because that is not what I look for in a player. The number 1 player in the world for me is the one who combines and balances all these factors from week to week matches, and for me that is Messi.

Collblanc wrote:The definition of 'the top 3 players'  in the world is different for everybody. One might find vision and passing much more important then off the ball movement and scoring, hence why there is a voting system, so everybody gets their say in the final results. Even if you would look at only statistics, its still a open discussion. You have goals + assists, but what leads to a assist? Was that also a contribution to the goal? There is no right or wrong in these discussion, only opinions and other views on what players need to be the 'best'.

For somebody who is a fan of players with high futbol intelligence and vision perhaps Pirlo or Xavi is the best player in the world. For someone like rwo- a goalkeeper is the best player in the world. Someone who likes dribbles and vision, Messi is the best player in the world. And another one would say Ronaldo is the best in the world because he scores from ridiculous ranges like no other. Messi doesn't have Pirlo's vision, Pirlo doesn't have Messi dribbling abilities, both dont have Ronaldo's long range shooting and vice versa. How can you decide for the whole wide world who is the better player? You cant, only your opinion on what makes someone the best can decide.

So, for me personally, i enjoy vision combined with high intelligence passes, dribbling skills and finishing. Again, for me (!!) Messi, Xavi, Iniesta, Ribery and Neymar have these abilities more then Ronaldo and Robben. On other aspects, like finishing; headers; freekicks, Ronaldo and Robben might stand out more against earlier named players, but I dont take that in consideration because that is not what I look for in a player. The number 1 player in the world for me is the one who combines and balances all these factors from week to week matches, and for me that is Messi.

This. 
Great post mate.