The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
Philipp Lahm is a boring player who will be forgotten very quickly though, at no point was he ever the best player in the world. He's was never even the best player on his team.
Much much much better players than him have not won the Balon D'Or lol.
Much much much better players than him have not won the Balon D'Or lol.
Zealous- World Class Contributor
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
As I said, worst thread on GL.
Forza- Fan Favorite
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
Forza wrote:As I said, worst thread on GL.
It isn't even as good as that tbh.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
Forza wrote:As I said, worst thread on GL.
You think Philip Lahm is the best player in the world?
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
Lahm was and is insanely good... one of the best fullbacks of the modern era and it's not even in doubt. Plays BOTH fullback positions at a WC level and even holding mid now.
To me, he's a legend. Given how crap modern fullbacks are, it's refreshing to still have someone like Lahm around who would be one of the best in any era.
That said, has a fullback ever made it on a podium let alone win the BdO? If Maldini, Cafu and Abidal couldn't make it, neither should Lahm. He's not as good as those 3.
To me, he's a legend. Given how crap modern fullbacks are, it's refreshing to still have someone like Lahm around who would be one of the best in any era.
That said, has a fullback ever made it on a podium let alone win the BdO? If Maldini, Cafu and Abidal couldn't make it, neither should Lahm. He's not as good as those 3.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
rwo power wrote:Really? What about Philipp Lahm who excels as LB, RB, DM, CM or whatever position he is thrown in bar goalkeeper? Only because he doesn't score goals, his playing intelligence isn't worth anything?
I don't understand what you are arguing here. That just because a player is best at their position, and is versatile, that they deserve the Ballon d'Or? I thought it was reserved for the best player in the world. There's no question that when it comes down to it the best players in the world are Messi and Ronaldo then everyone else. Nobody else is close.
Maybe people think it's unfair because there are a lot of great players in the world, but that's just reality.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
Roberto Carlos came second behind Ronaldo in 97 but that was the FIFA World Player of the year award.
In 2002 Roberto came second, again behind Ronaldo, in the Balon D'Or vote.
In 2002 Roberto came second, again behind Ronaldo, in the Balon D'Or vote.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
Well, what does "best player" actually mean? Could CR7 play holding mid on world class level? If not, why is he considered the best overall then? Lahm can play several positions at world class level - wouldn't he be more complete and thus better then?
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
rwo power wrote:Well, what does "best player" actually mean? Could CR7 play holding mid on world class level? If not, why is he considered the best overall then? Lahm can play several positions at world class level - wouldn't he be more complete and thus better then?
By this logic John O'Shea is the best player of all time
I don't see Lahm playing CF either so your versatility argument holds no water.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
rwo power wrote:Well, what does "best player" actually mean? Could CR7 play holding mid on world class level? If not, why is he considered the best overall then? Lahm can play several positions at world class level - wouldn't he be more complete and thus better then?
I think that if Ronaldo wanted to he could probably play any position well though obviously he is more suited to what he is doing now.
The thing is that the hardest thing to do in soccer is score goals. Why would you want Ronaldo to play a different position? Obviously it's difficult to compare across positions but most of the best players in the world want to play some kind of offensive position. For Ronaldo and Messi to be so far ahead of their peers even in that sense, when they play in the positions that have the most competition, just speaks to how good they are.
Not to take anything away from Lahm who is amazing, but it's not like he has a lot of competition for being the best at his position. Plus, I wouldn't say he's the best at several positions.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
Well, Roberto Carlos wasn't as good as Maldini, Cafu or Abidal either but Brazil won the WC in 2002. WC years can be weird so i can see Lahm getting some serious consideration since Germany won it. Neuer would be far more deserving if it's going to go to someone on Germany.
And "best player" in football had a big team component to it in BdO before FIFA took over and basically ruined it. That's why it had nothing to do with the individual abilities of a player solely... you not only had to be good but you had to take your team to the greatest heights. WC being the toughest tournament out there... a player taking a NT to a WC win gets a huge boost.
Ronaldo won CL and CDR. Lahm/Neuer won Bundi and WC. Since it's a FIFA award, not a UEFA one, i can see Blatter pushing it to go to one of the WC winners. I don't have a problem with any of them winning it tbh.
And "best player" in football had a big team component to it in BdO before FIFA took over and basically ruined it. That's why it had nothing to do with the individual abilities of a player solely... you not only had to be good but you had to take your team to the greatest heights. WC being the toughest tournament out there... a player taking a NT to a WC win gets a huge boost.
Ronaldo won CL and CDR. Lahm/Neuer won Bundi and WC. Since it's a FIFA award, not a UEFA one, i can see Blatter pushing it to go to one of the WC winners. I don't have a problem with any of them winning it tbh.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
My problem with that philosophy is that because it is a team game and managers actually do have a profound impact on the team itself (not to mention teammates) I don't feel like judging an individual based on team awards is the way to go. Do you really think that Portugal had a similar chance to Germany of winning the World Cup based on their rosters alone?
Look at their individual contribution on the pitch and then maybe use team awards (WC, CL, domestic titles) to break any kind of deadlock.
To me there's no question, at least as long as they continue to play at their levels exhibited over the last 7 years, Ronaldo and Messi should be 1 and 2 every year (interchangeable depending on who is on better form). But that's just my opinion.
Look at their individual contribution on the pitch and then maybe use team awards (WC, CL, domestic titles) to break any kind of deadlock.
To me there's no question, at least as long as they continue to play at their levels exhibited over the last 7 years, Ronaldo and Messi should be 1 and 2 every year (interchangeable depending on who is on better form). But that's just my opinion.
Last edited by El Cujo on Fri Oct 31, 2014 3:47 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
First of all Roberto was one of the greatest if not the greatest Leftback of all time. Of course he's as good as those guys come on now lol
Anyway if a German player has to win why not Kroos? Aside from the cagey final he was one of the stand out players for Germany in every game they played. Plus he has a legitimate claim to being one of the best in his position.
Everyone is saying Lahm/Neuer/Muller etc. but Kroos/Schweinsteiger were just as important.
Anyway if a German player has to win why not Kroos? Aside from the cagey final he was one of the stand out players for Germany in every game they played. Plus he has a legitimate claim to being one of the best in his position.
Everyone is saying Lahm/Neuer/Muller etc. but Kroos/Schweinsteiger were just as important.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
Kroos was not very influential in the CL or the Bundi this year though. He's played really well in the WC and at RM but he shouldn't be in the top 5. Neuer is the only German I would say should have a chance at the top 5.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
Roberto Carlos was always overrated to me because he was crap defensively mostly... his attack was great and he had a flamboyant playing style. Very good player no doubt and among the greats. But for me, a fullback can't be compared to the top tier of all time greats unless he's at least decent at his main job.... namely, defending. Too many blunders to go with great play by Roberto. He's the fullback version of Iker Casillas.
Maldini and Cafu did it all... Abidal was the best defensive fullback I have ever seen.
Maldini and Cafu did it all... Abidal was the best defensive fullback I have ever seen.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
El Cujo wrote:Kroos was not very influential in the CL or the Bundi this year though. He's played really well in the WC and at RM but he shouldn't be in the top 5. Neuer is the only German I would say should have a chance at the top 5.
But he was fantastic at the world cup which is basically the only reason Neuer and Lahm are being mentioned...
Winning the Bundesliga when you play for Bayern Munich is an irrelevant accomplishment, especially considering that they wrapped it up by April. Not to mention Bayern Munich got embarrassed in the CL by Madrid.
My point is if people are seriously going to support the "A German should win the Balon D'Or" Kroos is as strong a candidate as anyone. But no one who thinks like that is actually going to support Kroos because he bad mouthed Bayern and chose to join Madrid.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
@El Cujo... think about the MVP awards in the US in the NBA, NFL or NHL. Usually goes to the superstar who is on the best eastern or western team of the regular season regardless of not being the overall best player. If those teams don't have a superstar that can individually claim it within reason, then they go to the next 2 teams... That's kind of how BdO used to work. Since it's a FIFA award, they're going to look to give it to a star on the WC winning squad if they can reasonably do it.
Team sports awards have always been like that until recently in football.
Team sports awards have always been like that until recently in football.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
sportsczy wrote:Roberto Carlos was always overrated to me because he was crap defensively mostly... his attack was great and he had a flamboyant playing style. Very good player no doubt and among the greats. But for me, a fullback can't be compared to the top tier of all time greats unless he's at least decent at his main job.... namely, defending. Too many blunders to go with great play by Roberto. He's the fullback version of Iker Casillas.
Maldini and Cafu did it all... Abidal was the best defensive fullback I have ever seen.
Let's agree to disagree there, I'd take prime Roberto Carlos over any left back in history.
He was one of those rare players you could justify asking for people to pay money in order to watch him. He's Madrid greatest LB (just ahead of Camacho),one of Brazil's best ever players (part of the 4 R's) and he's won it all at Club and International level.
He literally has nothing to envy from those other guys. It all comes down to preference I guess.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
sportsczy wrote:@El Cujo... think about the MVP awards in the US in the NBA, NFL or NHL. Usually goes to the superstar who is on the best eastern or western team of the regular season regardless of not being the overall best player. If those teams don't have a superstar that can individually claim it within reason, then they go to the next 2 teams... That's kind of how BdO used to work. Since it's a FIFA award, they're going to look to give it to a star on the WC winning squad if they can reasonably do it.
Team sports awards have always been like that until recently in football.
I don't follow the NBA or NFL very much, but I know in the NHL it doesn't work that way at all. Plus their awards are a little different too (not to mention it's not across multiple leagues or competitions so you can't really compare to soccer). I like that the NHL has the Pearson trophy which allows the players in the NHL to vote on who they think is the best player in the league that season.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
Brazilians don't rate Roberto Calos that high Z... ask Ganso here. He made some major blunders that cost them games in WCs (1998 and 2006) and they hold him responsible for those tournament-ending losses. A bit unfair in 1998 although we wasn't faultless; but definitely true in 2006.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
Maldini finished 3rd once in the 90s iirc
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
NHL is a bit different because the players vote so you can see guys that were on very good teams get the Hart trophy although they weren't the best that season. Agreed on that.
It's easier to do that in the NHL because there are so many different awards. So it's a bad example on my part.
It's easier to do that in the NHL because there are so many different awards. So it's a bad example on my part.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
I don't mind the NHL award system though because it also awards a best defenceman, best defensive forward, and best goalie award. I know that's kind of implied with the 'best XI' but I wouldn't mind if they had best midfielder, best defender and best keeper awards for soccer.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
sportsczy wrote:Brazilians don't rate Roberto Calos that high Z... ask Ganso here. He made some major blunders that cost them games in WCs (1998 and 2006) and they hold him responsible for those tournament-ending losses. A bit unfair in 1998 although we wasn't faultless; but definitely true in 2006.
He was past his prime in 06 tbf. He wasn't the only one either.
Whether Brazillians are mad at him doesn't mean much. It doesn't all of a sudden erase his accomplishments.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
Tying your shoelace on a FK taken by Zidane in the 2nd half when you're supposed to mark Henry... that has nothing to do with being in your prime or not. That was ridiculous But i agree that it's a bit harsh. He did a lot of other reckless things for them over the years... i think that was the last straw. Remember him trying a bicycle kick clearance in his box for no reason and he missed the ball The striker took the ball and scored. In a WC again too. Remember he got torched for that and rightfully so.
Not saying RC wasn't great... but that there were greater ones than him in that era imo.
@El Cujo. Completely agree. There are different awards now a bit by position in footy. But not enough and they're not hyped enough. NHL is great model for pretty much everything imo.
Not saying RC wasn't great... but that there were greater ones than him in that era imo.
@El Cujo. Completely agree. There are different awards now a bit by position in footy. But not enough and they're not hyped enough. NHL is great model for pretty much everything imo.
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Re: The Official Balon d'Or 2014 Thread
1998 World Cup quarter finals against Denmark. It was so laughable and stupid to even attempt when all that was needed was a simple headed clearance. Not sure if it was one of the Laudrup brothers or Tommason that scored.sportsczy wrote:Remember him trying a bicycle kick clearance in his box for no reason and he missed the ball The striker took the ball and scored. In a WC again too. Remember he got torched for that and rightfully so.
.
If Taffarel could have gotten away with it, he would ended Roberto with his bare hands for that.
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