Re: Next Manager thread

[Hapless_Hans]

Alright then. Now we know.

Mislintat is basically chief squad planner now. Probably even more so than Reschke's 'technical director' role at Bayern 2014-2017. Interesting.

It sure sounds like it will Arteta. Still sounds bizarre to me, especially with the "extensive search" and " due diligence" process. It just seems strange you would conduct an extensive search and due diligence but would end up with Arteta rather than, say, Jardim.
At least it sounds like the diligent search is superimposed with a strong desire of appointing some Arsenal DNA young fresh faced prospect, otherwise you would not arrive there.

I kind of understand why Ancelotti would be decided against tbh (even if Daniel Taylor strongly pleads for him here https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2018/may/06/carlo-ancelotti-arsenal-manager ), but I don't really get the sniffing at Enrique. Are we really going to pretend that Enrique is not to be taken seriously as a top coach, after his immense success at Barca? I think of all the clubs looking for managers, Arsenal and Enrique might have been the best fit.

Another thing. It seems like Maurizio Sarri has very recently become potentially available. I think it's very strange and hard to believe Napoli would push him out tbh, but he might be on the market.

He should cut right in there onto the top of the list at Arsenal IMO.
Arteta is a nice thought and all, and maybe in lack of other candidates that really feel right this kind of gamble appointment can be dared.
But with a manager of Sarri's proven capability, for exciting, dominant, beautiful and successful football achieved on a modest budget, he should not be left for a rival club like Chelsea, of all clubs, to pick up. If you wanted Tuchel, Sarri would be absolutely the next best thing.

[urbaNRoots]

That Tuchel thing just makes this worse and worse.

We had the chance to sign a top class manager and now we’re settling for a couple of nobodies

Gazidis and Kroenke are a disgrace.

[Hapless_Hans]

That Tuchel thing just makes this worse and worse.

We had the chance to sign a top class manager and now we’re settling for a couple of nobodies

Gazidis and Kroenke are a disgrace.

Wenger decided to step down after the Bayern fiasco tho. So if Tuchel hadn't decided for PSG, he'd be at Bayern and not at Arsenal

[Jay29]

Only reason I can think of why Enrique was "never seriously considered" is that he wasn't that interested in the job in the first place. Maybe he wasn't as willing to slot in as head coach as others were.

I think the fact that Sarri wasn't mentioned suggests he's not as available as the press make out... though I fully expect him to rock up at Chelsea now that I've said that.

[Hapless_Hans]

Also, @urban, I think at some point you will have to just take off the bitter glasses and put some pink ones on instead.
I'm not saying your scepticism and cynicism is unfounded, but I think at this moment, is just makes more sense to suspend it and try to be positive and hopeful.
Arteta may positively suprise all of us yet.

[Hapless_Hans]

Only reason I can think of why Enrique was "never seriously considered" is that he wasn't that interested in the job in the first place. Maybe he wasn't as willing to slot in as head coach as others were.

Possible. Though, as has been said before, the notion that all these continental managers have a problem with a continental management structure, and are not willing to collaborate on squad planning or work an a comparably modest budget, is rather absurd.
I honestly regard such reports as projections of that bizarre English resentment against the mere idea of a DoF (though in reality they're at work almost everywhere). A resentment which reminds me very much, in structure, ignorance, and pervasiveness, of the resentment vs "zonal marking" lmao. And the 'transfer kitty' stuff comes from English media obsession with, well, 'transfer kitties'.

I think the fact that Sarri wasn't mentioned suggests he's not as available as the press make out... though I fully expect him to rock up at Chelsea now that I've said that.

I very much hope that is the case. Would hate seeing Sarri at Chelsea. Now, having pushed Conte out, would be the perfect moment for Chelsea to start declining thoroughly.

[urbaNRoots]

Also, @urban, I think at some point you will have to just take off the bitter glasses and put some pink ones on instead.
I'm not saying your scepticism and cynicism is unfounded, but I think at this moment, is just makes more sense to suspend it and try to be positive and hopeful.
Arteta may positively suprise all of us yet.

I will support Arteta once he is appointed, it’s still a better choice than continuing with Wenger.

I don’t have anything against Arteta, he was a great player and a great captain for Arsenal. My problem is with the Arsenal board and their lack of ambition. It pisses me off that everything rivals fans and journalists said about this club is turning out to be true. We’re a mid table club and have no ambition other than being Kroenke’s toy.

It’s a bitter pill to swallow but swallow it we must.

[Jay29]

Possible. Though, as has been said before, the notion that all these continental managers have a problem with a continental management structure, and are not willing to collaborate on squad planning or work an a comparably modest budget, is rather absurd.
I honestly regard such reports as projections of that bizarre English resentment against the mere idea of a DoF (though in reality they're at work almost everywhere). A resentment which reminds me very much, in structure, ignorance, and pervasiveness, of the resentment vs "zonal marking" lmao. And the 'transfer kitty' stuff comes from English media obsession with, well, 'transfer kitties'.

Yeah, the whole unwilling to work under a management structure thing is strange when you consider most, if not all, coaches outside of the UK work that way. Even within the UK now more and more clubs are adopting that model (in fact, I believe United are the only top club who haven't yet).

But I don't know, part of me thinks Enrique might have liked to have had more influence after all the politics at Barcelona. That, or maybe he and Sanhelli aren't so keen on each other. I mean, Barca's former director should know plenty about him, right?

I'm just pulling things from my rear end at this point. There has to be a logic somewhere.

[Hapless_Hans]

Right. I didn't think of that- you have a former Barca guy in there as quasi- DoF now
Absoluty right, then surely we can assume the reason Enrique would not become Arsenal manager would not be that he slipped their minds...

[urbaNRoots]

I won’t even have to talk about that £50m transfer budget despite having the highest ticket prices in the entire world. That’s a Watford/Everton-esque budget, further confirming our new status in the Premier League.

[Hapless_Hans]

I wouldn't pay to much attention to such figurse. Arsenal have spent A LOT of money in recent years. You don't have CL so it will be a bit less now, perhaps, but I don't think lack of funds, or readiness to spend, actually are problems at all you should be concerned with. It's high time to scrap that nauseating "spend some money" BS IMO.

[urbaNRoots]

Arsenal haven’t spent shit, we sold half our squad for £100m and got two players for £100m. In fact Arsenal have created a profit in the last two transfer windows.

We are also the only club in recent history (if ever?) to not sign a single outfield player in a summer transfer window.

We are run by absolute c*nts.

[Great Leader Sprucenuce]

We are also the only club in recent history (if ever?) to not sign a single outfield player in a summer transfer window.

We are run by absolute c*nts.

You wish lol.

[urbaNRoots]

Says it all really, everyone knows what a greedy fat c*nt Ashley is and Kroenke is no different.

At least it looks like he’ll be gone soon while the american inbred freak isn’t going anywhere.

[rincon]

I think the fact that Sarri wasn't mentioned suggests he's not as available as the press make out... though I fully expect him to rock up at Chelsea now that I've said that.

I very much hope that is the case. Would hate seeing Sarri at Chelsea. Now, having pushed Conte out, would be the perfect moment for Chelsea to start declining thoroughly.

Sarri is/was likely available. Working for ADL is no small feat of patience and he has been there for 3 years. This season he took that group as far as he'll likely take them in Serie A in terms of performances. Its bit of the end of a cycle. Add to that the fact that ADL publicly criticized Sarri these last few weeks and I'm sure he can be got by a rich club.

Now they started their meeting to clarify the future. There's a good chance he remains, and a good chance that he could have been convinced by a foreign project.

[RealGunner]

Some great discussion in the last 2 pages.

Moving to a continental model was the obvious thing to do. Arsene was a special man who had enormous character to handle everything however even then it wasn't the best of ideas to have him control everything and now is of course the best time to bring in a proper structure which the new manager can benefit from.

What Ornstein said about 'new man will continue the values instilled by Wenger' is what I said last night too. It's not really a secret that the board wants to move a bit differently than other clubs by bringing in someone who can create his own legacy in the same mold as Arsene. So someone like Arteta or Vieira or Nagelsmann makes sense. Arteta is their favourite because he feels more connected to Arsenal and loves the club. Something which I value greatly. But it's also a massive risk as everyone has suggested because people like Arsene, Pep, Jose are rare in football who come from being nobody to being successful and becoming legends in the game. There are A LOT more gary monks out there than Pep guardiolas. So it is a risk.

I think Enrique was never really considered because he just doesn't fit any sort of profile we have in place. He is unremarkable in every way. Won a treble with one of the greatest trios in modern times. Other than that his career is average. His strength is motivation and bringing urgency to the team's play. Neither is what you would call 'extraordinary'. You can hire Big Sam to bring those two qualities in. And not to mention Enrique would want well over 200m transfer budget to make a super team.

I don't really know why Sarri wasn't considered but if I were to take a guess, it was because of his image and how he presents himself which is nothing short of a madman.

I find it hard to believe a club like Arsenal have a £50m budget. Even if we spent so much on Auba and Lacazette. It still is a shock. But with the amount of surplus to requirement players we have at the club, i am sure selling the likes of Mustafi can bring in 50m more to make it 100m. Although it won't be a surprise if Arsenal are being quiet about money.

[RealGunner]

In more guess work. Xabi Alonso could be Arteta's assistant lmao

[boyzis]

im sure xabi alonso and arteta have similar mindset and tactical approach to the game. There was an interview some time ago where xabi seemed to address every problem arsenal had in their setup.
the only thing that needs to be figured out is how will likes of ozil etc be managed by arteta for that arsenal need gilberto viera Henry Pires lehman etc to be more authoritative.

[El Gunner]

Got to say I am also on board for the continental model, it would be interesting to see how it works. It's better that way these days in football, to be honest, too many stuff going on, one guy can't be in charge and have the final say on it all.

[Jay29]

On the whole £50m budget thing: this is not as concerning as it appears.

Here's a good read on why: https://shewore.com/2018/05/19/arsenals-50m-budget-explained/

Basically, clubs budget for transfer fees over the duration of a players contract, and not all in one go. So £50m player on a five year deal does not mean £50m taken out the budget - it means £10m out of the budget for that year plus whatever salary we're paying him that year.

Then you factor in player departures (Ornsetin called it a "pre-sales budget", don't forget), which is less important for the fee we receive and more important for the wages it frees up, which balances out the wages we'd give to new players.

So Mertesacker retires, then his salary can go straight onto a new CB without taking anything out of that reported £50m.

Hypothetically speaking, we could sign these players:

Papastathopoulos - £20m, 2 year contract
Soyuncu - £35m, 5 year contract
Seri - £40m, 4 year contract

Reports would present this as £95m spent on players, but in actuality it'd just be £27m plus wages (and agent fees and whatnot), offset by players sales.

Don't let the low number fool you into thinking the club has to scrounge for bargains.

[Sina]

Mikel Arteta Arsenal manager: The case for and against





Arsenal are edging closer to appointing former captain Mikel Arteta as their new head coach, a decision bound to cause consternation, intrigue or excitement depending on your disposition. The cold reality of England's third-biggest club appointing a man who has never managed a competitive game is quite extraordinary, following Arsène Wenger who sat in the Arsenal dugout 1,235 times.

So are Arsenal making a brave decision that will inject youthful zeal and fresh ideas into a stale environment, or an unambitious appointment that risks deepening divides in the fan-base and prolonging a spell away from Europe's top table? The passing of time will decide, but for now let's examine both sides of the argument.

The case for Arteta
How much of a risk really is it?

The Premier League table is stratified by wealth, which is worrying for the competition's health but reassuring for Arsenal and Arteta who have a safety net beneath them. In 2017-18, Arsenal won four of 19 away games yet still finished nine points clear of seventh-placed Burnley. The league's dynamic changes every season, but things would have to go spectacularly badly for Arsenal to finish any lower than sixth.

The embarrassing away form also means there is vast room for improvement and potentially easy gains. If Arteta is of sufficient competence to guide Arsenal to victory at Watford, Bournemouth, Brighton, Newcastle and West Ham, then there is a 14-point improvement straight away. Those points would take Arsenal to 77, which last season would have had them level with 3rd-placed Spurs.

Given the weakness of the Premier League's non-existent middle class, and the attacking players at Arsenal's disposal, such a points tally should be within Arteta's reach.



For all of Jurgen Klopp and Mauricio Pochettino's excellent work, they have benefited from starting at a low base and a feeling that Liverpool and Spurs are ascendant. In a strange way, years of consistently finishing in the top four denied Arsenal the chance to experience a similar resurgence. Now they can.

He does not need to 'manage' Arsenal

Ivan Gazidis and his allies have spent the last few years painstakingly prising the levers of control from Wenger's grip, often met with resistance from Arsenal's former manager. Head of recruitment Sven Mislintat, former Barcelona director Raul Sanllehi, contract guru Huss Fahmy and director of high performance Darren Burgess were hired to spread power and responsibility throughout the club, where once it resided in the hands of one man.

It would make little sense therefore, to hire a manger who will challenge this new reality. For years, Arsenal's behaviour and actions (or lack of) l have sent out a message to managers: 'Come to Arsenal, be well-paid in one of the world's great cities, and we'll let you do as you please until the fans stop turning up'.


The powers that be will be keen to change that message, making clear that the head coach is subordinate to them. Hiring a combative manager who wants as much power as possible could be a recipe for civil war. Four or five key individuals have replaced Wenger, Arteta just needs to coach, motivate and select the first-team.

Arteta is not a one-club 'yes' man

Arteta has strong affiliations with Arsenal but it is by no means institutionalised. Educated at Barcelona's La Masia, he went on to play for Paris Saint-Germain, Rangers and Everton, playing under managers as varied as Alex McLeish and Luis Fernandez.

Arteta was offered the chance of a youth-level job at Arsenal, but took the decision to leave and further his education at Manchester City under Pep Guardiola. Staying in the warm bath of London Colney would have been the easier option. It is an eclectic football grounding that means while Arteta 'knows the club', he should have enough perspective to see Arsenal's weaknesses.

He was also offered a position on Pochettino's coaching staff at Spurs. These are not typical job offers for recently retired pros, so it is fair to assume Arteta is not Joe Average. People talk in football, and they are saying good things about him.

No more Groundhog Season

Apathy eventually did for for Wenger, with Arsenal season ticket holders deciding to leave seats empty in their thousands. The lack of a league title, poor performances and soft defending were all tangible reasons for them to be disgruntled. More damaging however, was the sense that Arsenal were always crashing in the same car to use a David Bowie title.

Hope is football fans' oxygen, and Arsenal fans had lost hope that each season would have a different outcome than the last. They knew Wenger like he was one of the family: every catchphrase, substitution, tactical tweak and excuse.

Now they have a completely blank canvas facing them, a chance to learn about a new man from scratch with no preconceptions. Staring straight into the unknown is daunting and stressful, but should also be a cause for excitement. No fan will have the right to say they are bored (for a few years at least).

He doesn't have to stay for 22 years

If hiring Arteta is the wrong decision, results will be poor, it will be embarrassing for Arsenal that they have mis-judged such a key decision and Gazidis could come under significant pressure. But, guess what? Arsenal sack their manager and hire a new one! Who would have thought such a thing was possible?

Arsenal have been a unique case for the past decade, having to tread delicately around a manger whose past achievements levitated him to demi-god status. The scenario will never be replicated. Arsenal will appoint multiple managers over the next 22 years, and whether he is a success or a failure, Arteta will be just one of them.


The case against Arteta

Inexperience

The obvious place to start: Arteta has never done the job before, which in most spheres of life would be a considerable handicap. Comparisons with the arrival of an unheralded and unknown Wenger in 1996 are misguided. The 'Arsene Who?" greeting spoke more to English football's insularity than his personal history - Wenger had already managed for more than a decade and taken Monaco to the latter stages of European competition.

Parallels with mentor Guardiola or Zinedine Zidane are inaccurate too. Barcelona and Real Madrid's B teams, where both managers cut their teeth for a short time, playing in competitive leagues in Spain's lower divisions. Arteta may have accumulated a wealth of knowledge, but has never (we assume) endured sleepless nights trying to pick an eleven or been held responsible for results.

Arteta is bound to make mistakes as he learns his trade, and Arsenal could suffer the consequences. On the other hand, Wenger made his share too.

The age of Arsenal's squad

Arsenal's players have got it in the neck repeatedly over the past few seasons, called 'pussy-footed', 'cowards' and 'spineless' by notable pundits. They now have a chance to ram those words down their throat by prospering under a new regime.

While there are areas that need improvement and renewal, particularly in the back-half of the team, this is a more attractive squad than many think. Aaron Ramsey, Mesut Özil, Henrikh Mkhitaryan, Alexandre Lacazette and Pierre-Emerick Aubameyang are one quality winger away from being a stellar attacking line-up. All are in the prime of their career.



Had Arsenal managed to tempt Massimiliano Allegri away from Juventus, and made the right moves in the transfer market to strengthen at the back, they could have been very competitive, very quickly. On the balance of probability, that is less likely under Arteta (though by no means impossible). The risk is that Arteta takes two seasons to fully master the job, by which time the last few top-level years of Aubameyang, Özil et al have been wasted. Cue another rebuild, which might be a better time for Arteta to come in and start anew.

Keeping up appearances

Arsenal's status in European football is not quite diminished, but consecutive seasons in the Europa League does make the badge seem smaller. Results and performances on the grass should be the only thing that counts, but it is increasingly important for clubs to manage 'perception'.

Manchester United in the post-Ferguson years have been particularly committed to 'keeping up appearances', lavishing money on high-profile, marketable players and hiring Jose Mourinho. If they were no longer winning titles, United made damn sure they won the PR war and stayed at the top of the news cycle.  



Concerns about Arteta's CV aside, there is a theory that Arsenal need a similar shot in the arm. If you cannot play in the Champions League, a high profile appointment can give the outward appearance that you are still operating at the highest level, or at least striving to do so. Hiring Arteta will feel a little small-time to some fans. The argument is flimsy because results are the only measure, but the feeling Arsenal have 'settled' could linger.

Too close to the old regime

Arteta only cleared his locker at London Colney in 2016, and as the preferred candidate of chief executive Ivan Gazidis  he will be viewed as a 'club man'. Critics charged that Arsenal was too comfortable an environment under Wenger, with a lack of consequences for underperformance and no accountability. There will be scepticism about Arteta's ability to tackle this culture and raise standards. Gazidis spoke of the need to preserve Arsenal's values, and the appointment of Arteta is consistent with that, but some will argue that the values themselves need to change.


Divisions remain

Making decisions to appease fans will prove a ruinous philosophy at any club, but Arsenal will be fully aware of the need to unite supporters after a fractious period. At the very least, they will want to avoid a corrosive appointment that aggravates pre-existing gripes. One should not mistake some of the loudest voices on Twitter as representative of the 60,000 at the Emirates, but appointing Arteta will divide opinion. A quick scan of the digitally active corner of the fan-base shows that many of the most vociferous anti-Wenger voices are also hostile to Arteta.

However, if Arsenal win their first 10 matches of the next season such discord will ease and Arteta's name will be sung with vigour. It was ever thus.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2018/05/18/mikel-arteta-arsenal-manager-case-against

[GRude]

No need to read all that bruv, it's pretty simple

Allegri, Conte, Ancelotti etc = former great big club trying to restore it's reputation and hit the big time
Arteta = pointless greedy, cheap hipster club aiming for 4th

Next appointment will define Arsenal for the rest of the Kreonke's reign.

[Sina]

Times: Arteta has named who he wants in his coaching team and has been finalising the details of his contract in the past few days. #AFC are expected to announce him this week.

— Arsènic (@MrArsenicTM) May 20, 2018

[RealGunner]

Would be cool if Xabi is part of the coaching team.

[Unique]

Former Paris Saint-Germain boss Unai Emery will hold talks with Arsenal on Monday about their vacant manager's job, according to Sky Sports' Spanish football expert Guillem Balague.

The 46-year-old Spaniard was sacked as PSG manager earlier this month despite having led the French side to a domestic treble.

[El Gunner]

Thoughts on Emery?

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